From Ministry to Real Estate – How Scott Poirier Built a Thriving Business

Title: “From Ministry to Real Estate – How Scott Poirier Built a Thriving Business”

Episode: 237

Know other people’s stories. It is Scot Poirier’s striking advice for investors on their first deal.

In this episode of the Profit First for REI podcast, Scot, a successful real estate investor and coach, gives you practical advice on investing in real estate and how to get a seller to open up.

He also shares his story of his first deal and the challenges he overcame in his journey. Listen to have the right motivation and hope to pursue your real estate investing journey. Enjoy the show! 

Key Takeaways:

[00:39] Introducing Scot Poirier

[02:55] Life before real estate investing

[06:17] His very first deal

[09:57] After repair value

[10:49] The wake-up call

[16:51] Learning about people

[25:28] How can you make people open up to you?

[30:22] Remove ‘permission language’

[33:10] Connect with Scot Poirier


[05:13] “People are people. They have crises, and they need to have a sense of trust to work with you.”

[10:51] “When you don’t know that you don’t know, you might get lucky on a deal, but when the other shoot drops, it hurts.” 

[29:12] “Don’t give up. Surround yourself with good people. People that have your interest in mind.”

Connect with Scot:

Website: https://www.facebook.com/scot.poirier 

Tired of living deal to deal? 

If you are a real estate investor or business owner who is tired of living deal to deal and want to double your profits, head over here to book your no-obligation discovery call with me. Either myself or someone from my team will hop on a short call with you to get clear on your business goals, remove any obstacles holding you back, and map out a game plan to help you finally start keeping more of the money you work so hard to make. – David


Speaker 1 (00:00):

First of all, surround yourself with the right people. You have to surround yourself with people that are pro you and sometimes pro you. People can also tell you what you need to hear.

Speaker 2 (00:13):

If you’re a real estate investor who’s sick and tired of living deal to deal, then welcome home. Hear from everyday real estate investors just like you, and discover how they’ve completely transformed their business by taking a profit First approach. This is the profit first for REI podcast, where we believe revenue is vanity. Profit is sanity. It’s time to start making profit, a habit in your business. So here’s your host, David Richter.

Speaker 3 (00:40):

This episode with Scott Poirier is really good. He gives you very practical advice today on how to get a seller to open up. He’s got one big word, one word, super easy word, and then a couple other things that he tells you with very simple steps of how to get sellers to open up. I think you can make a lot more money. He tells about his first deal, how it was like an accidental home run, and then his second deal was an absolute dumpster fire that cost him years of his life and how he overcame that. So he’s got a lot of stuff here. This should give you hope and wind beneath your wings here because he’s got a lot of experience to help with, and I know that if you listed this, you can end up making more money. So buckle in and learn from Scott. Hey Scott, thanks for being on the podcast today. I’m super excited about this. Number one, because of your background. Number two, we’re a part of some of the same groups that I love being a part of these groups together that tells you who you’re around and what they attract and all the things that we think the same. And then I do like your background too. Like I said, I’m very interested to dig into this. So Scott, thanks for being on the podcast today,

Speaker 1 (01:45):

Man, it’s great to be here. David. I feel like I’m with a rockstar here, so I’m honored, honored to talk with you and to talk with your folks as well.

Speaker 3 (01:55):

I’m excited because when I was reading your bio, you said interpersonal skills. You’ve got rehabbing experience wholesale, you’ve got quite the smorgasbord of experience in your past. So let me just ask you, did you start real estate later in life or was there something early on, or did you grow up on real estate with your family? How’d you even get interested in that side of the world?

Speaker 1 (02:20):

I’m kind of reading into your question here because you’re looking at me going, okay, this is definitely an older gentleman, so I wonder how long really doing this.

Speaker 3 (02:28):

Oh man.

Speaker 1 (02:29):

Actually I started, it was really out of need just to supplement income, and some of that has to do with my background. What

Speaker 3 (02:36):

Stage of life?

Speaker 1 (02:37):

So it was 11 years ago, so I’m two. So I was in my early fifties. Fifties, early

Speaker 3 (02:44):

Fifties. And what did you do before

Speaker 1 (02:46):

Then? So I’ve been full-time ministry pretty much all of my adult life over 30 years as a pastor. Started with youth and family ministry. Most people said I was crazy, but I loved it. You

Speaker 3 (03:00):

Seem like a youth and family. You have that energy. I would not have guessed 62. I would’ve guessed early fifties because you bring an energy to,

Speaker 1 (03:09):

I’m going to send you a card situation

Speaker 3 (03:13):

All I want. Just send me that. No money, just send me the Christmas card. Okay, so youth and family ministries, and then did you become a pastor from there of the lead pastor or something?

Speaker 1 (03:24):

Believe it or not, they let me say, hey. They’re like, man, we want you to just be the pastor here. And to be honest with you, I never changed my stick at all. I’ve always had this energy and I realized that you can talk to adults the same way that you can to teenagers. In fact, I think it’s preferable and really just keep it very straight, very open. Young people. Young people can sniff you out if you’re not playing the game, right? I mean, they really can. So just that transparency and honesty and energy has served me really all these years in ministry.

Speaker 3 (03:54):

It seems like you’ve learned a lot of skills from being in the ministry that have helped in the business world as well too, because I love what you just said right there. You put things on the bottom shelf and you shoot straight with people. Do you think that that’s contributed to anything when you got into the real estate world as well?

Speaker 1 (04:12):

I had no idea. I didn’t come into the real estate world. David thinking, okay, I’m switching from ministry. I fell into the real estate world to go. I got to do something to supplement income, worked. All of my wife and I worked hard all of our lives. It was a calling to do what I’ve done in ministry. I still get to do some things in ministry. It’s not in a paid capacity. I got to rethink that. But anyway, but even when it was pay, it wasn’t anything to brag about, I promise you. Oh, sure, yeah. You’ve never seen me on TV doing this. So we had to do something as I was getting older. So in my fifties, in my early fifties, I thought I got to get another way of getting some income in. So I fell into real estate, and it was in that I discovered, oh my goodness, the stuff that I could be doing here, and I made some mistakes and that woke me up as well. But that’s what led me into real estate and I had no idea that it feels just like ministry. I had no idea that it was going to be really the same thing. I’m just dealing with people. So whether if they’re church people or not, people, people have crisis. They have hangups. They need to have a sense of trust, all this stuff to be able to work with you. It’s the same thing in ministry, man.

Speaker 3 (05:24):

Yeah, no, that’s really good. So it has prepared you. Now, I know you brushed over, but the mistakes, do you mind, do you want to go into that? Do you want to go? I like when people are No, he just walked off screen. I’m sorry. No. Okay. What happened?

Speaker 1 (05:44):

I think I’ve got to share it because I think we set up people when we don’t, first of all, sometimes we get some hiccups. The fortunate thing is, I guess if you can find someone that you really trust and they’ve had a huge hiccup, they can probably save you from a lot if you can learn through that. That’s

Speaker 3 (06:01):

Why I love when people tell that stuff, because I’ve heard some things on here. I’m like, that’s just going to help anyone going through this at this point, because we’re all human, but we just like to hide under a rock sometimes. Yeah,

Speaker 1 (06:11):

Yeah. No, I hear you. I think you might like this because I’m going to talk about the very first deal that I ever did that actually worked out pretty good, but it was purely accidental. I want to own that, right? But I think you’ll like it because of what we did with our IRA money. So we went collect IRA. So a good friend of mine that also came to my church, he and I were talking one day. He was really the technical guy. I’m really not a technical human being. All I know how to do is flat. My gums really, I have a high eq, but not really into the technical kinds of things. You don’t want me to swing the hammer? I can do fix and flip, but I’m not fixing. I flip.

Speaker 3 (06:45):

That’s good.

Speaker 1 (06:48):

So we decided, he did all this research about self-directed IRAs, and he approached me. We had a conversation and we said, yeah, let’s commingle our IRAs, my wife and I and his wife and him, and we bought two, five unit buildings, apartment buildings that we still own to this day. It’s just insane what these things are worth and what the cashflow we lend out of it with all that, with all the profit that’s come in. So I would love to say, man, we were so smart. I might say we had the hand of God on us that blessed us, but later we had lessons we had to learn. We did the first deal. Things were great. And I thought, well,

Speaker 3 (07:24):

And that first deal was the five, the two five units,

Speaker 1 (07:27):

Two five units it was, and

Speaker 3 (07:28):

That you still have today. Okay. Before you keep going onto the mistakes. I do have to ask about that. The technical guy, did he have a background in real estate and did he know that these were going to be home runs and that you would still own these? However many years later,

Speaker 1 (07:43):

International, international Construction worked for the, actually with the company he worked with. They did us contracts around the world, Midea all over the place, billion dollar deals, a financial mine, I mean a really good financial mine. And he would tell you if he were here right now, he’d be like, I didn’t know anything about real.

Speaker 3 (08:03):

It’s great. So it sounds like a happy accident all the way around with you, with him, with everyone. Now you’ve still got it. So I just wondered. I love that it’s your network, right? It’s the network there and provided that first opportunity, because usually that’s the hardest, right? Getting into it just the first time.

Speaker 1 (08:20):

But it was the second one that was the wake up

Speaker 3 (08:22):

Call. Okay. What happened on the second

Speaker 1 (08:24):

One? It warn us. That led us to say, we got to rethink how we do this. Okay. Yeah. So the second one, we thought, ah, we could do fix and flip.

Speaker 3 (08:32):

So you went from the two unit. Did you have to fix and flip that or the five unit, the two five units? Did you have to flip those or fix them up?

Speaker 1 (08:39):

Well, we had to fix them up. Yeah. We had to polish, maybe I’ll call it Polish, Polish one a little bit more than the other. But because there was all this money in the IRA, it didn’t feel like real money. You know what I mean? I, I knew that all the years of investing that that money was in there, but it wasn’t tangible.

Speaker 3 (08:58):

How many years ago was this?

Speaker 1 (09:00):

It was in 2013, 11 years ago.

Speaker 3 (09:02):

So if that was 11 years ago, you couldn’t touch it either, right? Because you were at 52 or at that point. So you still had years until it could become real money in your pocket. Okay,

Speaker 1 (09:14):

That makes sense. And I still haven’t touched it to this day. We’re just letting this and we’re private lending out of every, all even

Speaker 3 (09:18):

Better. Yeah, that’s good stuff.

Speaker 1 (09:20):

I would not have even known to have done that 11 years ago, but it’s because of the other stuff that I learned as a result of getting hit in the back of the head with Scott, you don’t know what you are doing to help fast. So we get this fix and flip this thing. This was a house that we bought it off the MLS, we found it on the MLS, worked with a realtor. We ran our numbers. We even had a private lender that had talked to us and said, I think you guys are, you’re not seeing the property. Your numbers are not right. I went back over it. I thought, no way. I’ve got this thing figured out. I think I know what I didn’t even know it was called a RV at the time after repaired value way for anyone listening. The way I look at after repaired value is this way. It just tells me what the top of the market looks like for a house that’s very similar to this in

Speaker 3 (10:11):

That point in time.

Speaker 1 (10:14):

So we run all these numbers, we got this thing down. We even put a contingency, I think we even did a 20% contingency. I must have read that somewhere, that that’s what you want to do or something, right? So we go into this thing. This house was built in 1800. The place was a disaster. We started opening up walls and it was just none of the place was insulated. I mean, we literally lost our shirt. I mean, we’re well into the six figures. Took us years to recover from it


To pay all this debt back. And we did. I mean, we just hung in there and we just slowly just pay, pay, pay. But that’s when the wake up call came in and said, okay, we clearly don’t really know what we’re doing. We have good intentions, and I run into people all the time with good intentions, but when you don’t know that you don’t know, you might get lucky on a deal or maybe even two. But wait, when the other shoe drops, man, it’s going to hurt. And you know what happens to most people? They just walk away from it after. That’s just bad business. And they walk away. I did was I got help. And since that, I’m telling you since that reality, and I even have a coach today, I’ve always had someone that’s further down the road than I am, and it’s been worth every dime. In fact, it’s allowed me to now build a real estate company. I didn’t come into this for that. I wanted to supplement my income so that I could take care of my family from when I couldn’t work anymore.

Speaker 3 (11:41):

Oh man. So biggest lessons learned, need help, need someone who’s been there. And then I would say another one too. It sounds like you had a private lender even tell you, I don’t know if you’re saying this, someone who was even there. So it’s like, was that also a wake up call of other people that might be in this deal and listening to them down the road too?

Speaker 1 (12:04):

Yeah. Yeah. Always listen to the people. If there’s somebody, like when you play out the private lender, so you got someone who’s eager to invest their money to make money, and you go, yeah, I wouldn’t invest in this deal with my money. Maybe I’d invest in it with your money, but I’m not using my money by the way we invested with our money because we literally lost our shirt. We really Oh, wow. David Painful. So yeah, listen to those other people. I think it’s about, first of all, surround yourself with the right people. You have to surround yourself with people that are pro you and sometimes pro you people can also tell you what you need to hear. I promise you this. My wife is really close to me. She’ll tell me what I need to hear.

Speaker 3 (12:48):

Yeah, shit. There’s no holding back there.

Speaker 1 (12:51):

That’s right. So we want to be with good people that really do have our interest in mind. And you want people that are for you, but you also want people that are ahead of you. And I think even a private lender, if today I was looking at something and I don’t really use a lot of hard money when I use the term private lender, I’m working with people that know me like me and trust me. And


I promise you that those people, they’re not in the industry. They’re putting the paper in front of me saying, sign right here. I’m ready to go. They’re even want to know what the deal is because they really trust me. I feel uneasy with that sometimes. And I’m like, yo, let me just tell you about loan to value. They’re like, okay, where do I sign, Scott? So I like working with private lenders because I can also get a lower interest rate, but there’s a lot of flexibility in what I get to do. But if a hard money lender says, Scott, I’m not investing in this. That’s got to be a wake up call.

Speaker 3 (13:44):

Yeah, yeah. No, that’s big. Sounds like some big lessons learned on deal number two. That does make me ask the question, how did deal 3, 4, 5, 6, how did those next deals go? Were they better while you were recovering from deal number two?

Speaker 1 (14:00):

Never had, and I want to be careful. I don’t want to jinx anything here. Knock on wood in the sense that we never lost again. I’m not saying that. Well, there’s still some other lessons. Sometimes you get eager and you go for a property and it’s so marginal. I’m like, man, yeah, okay, we didn’t lose anything, but I just worked for seven bucks an hour. I don’t work for six an hour, but never back in that situation again, the mistake we made was so fundamental, but we didn’t even know it just didn’t know. Yeah,

Speaker 3 (14:35):

I do like what you said. You didn’t know what you didn’t know. And that’s where having someone that’s down the road helping you get to where they got and then avoid some of those pitfalls and it’s been worth every dollar. That was I think, really, really good advice sometimes. Have you ever seen those posts on Facebook? I’m never going to buy this, or I’m never going to have a mentor or a coach, or I could just find everything on YouTube and I just get sick to my stomach. Yes, you can find a lot on there, but it’s totally different when you have a person walking through with you. But I think what you said is also really good. You said someone that has your best intentions and is really looking out for you. Let’s be honest too. Not everyone has your best intentions out there, and a lot of people are just like, what can I get out of this? So sounds like you’ve found those people throughout your life over the past 10 years, especially the past 10 years in the real estate world, sounds like.

Speaker 1 (15:24):

Yep, for sure. Absolutely. Every dime was worth it. I think it saved me years and a lot of other heartache. I think if I had gotten slammed with another really bad one, I probably would’ve said maybe I could. Nothing wrong with working at McDonald’s, but maybe that’s how I supplement my income and get a free meal every now and then.

Speaker 3 (15:46):

Yeah, no kidding. Good grief. It’s funny that you bring that up. I bring that story up when I tell it about the guy that we’ve been working with for a while and his CPA should have just been working at McDonald’s versus your real estate company if you’re going to do all this activity and not make any money for it. So thank you for sharing the mistake on deal number two, and that really helps. So you got into it to supplement it, you then built a company around it, but then I mean 30 years in the ministry, did you ever think that you would have a business like this or that you would go into the business side of it during any of those years?

Speaker 1 (16:22):

No, there’s just so much, especially when you’re in that kind of a career as well, that first of all, education can never teach you. I think what I meaning formal education.

Speaker 3 (16:31):

Formal education, okay.

Speaker 1 (16:32):

Formal education I don’t think can ever teach you what over 30 years of ministry ended up teaching. I mean, I went to seminary, learned all this stuff, learned maybe how to think critically or whatever, but it’s not until you sit across the table in living rooms and hospital rooms where you learn an awful lot about people, circumstances, crisis. And if you’re really open to engaging people and really wanting to be helpful, you end up having a whole lot more empathy and realizing once you know the story of somebody, I don’t know how far we want to go down this road, but Oh, I love

Speaker 3 (17:07):

This. This is great. I think this is helpful.

Speaker 1 (17:10):

Sometimes we can be judgmental in the way that we see things the way that we want the world to be and all that stuff. And it’s so easy to just paint someone and go, I know what their problem is. Well sit at a bedside with somebody or talk to a mom whose 18-year-old son overdosed and died on drugs and they do have an awful story and maybe they made a bunch of mistakes. But when you can connect with that and empathy really comes out, that’s where you can really be helpful. And that’s kind of a dramatic story I guess. But I have found in real estate, a lot of the people that I get to work with, they do have some crisis. They’ve got a bad story. And I think what ministry taught me, not in seminary, but in just the real world really me really wanting to be helpful, genuinely helpful, forced me to have to deal with people in their story to go, what am I going to do? Am I going to judge it or am I going to still be helpful? I chose to still be helpful and that’s really helped me in real estate.

Speaker 3 (18:16):

So I want to ask this question. When you sit across from a seller, I see you as someone who probably asks about their history, their story, and really trying to get and dig deep. Would you say that’s how you approach it when you talk with people across or do you have a different approach? I’m just very curious on how you approach talking with people.

Speaker 1 (18:35):

Well, I dive deeper when I’m convinced that I should stay on the phone. So I do have some techniques, and this is part of the interpersonal skills that I’ve learned. There are certain things I want to get out of the way on the front end, one of the first things I’m trying to determine is am I potentially dealing with a flexible human being?


If I feel like I say feel, but it’s based on questions that I’m asking. Everything I do is based on questions. If you could hear some of my stuff and I record a lot of my stuff, but I use a lot of loops, a lot of language. If you hung around me for a while, you’d be like, at first you’d be like, wow, Scott, you sound kind of smooth and wow. Yeah. And then you did it again with me and again and again. You’d be like, this guy’s boring man. He says the same stuff all the time, and it’s true, which is why it’s so easy for me to do it. I got rhythms down, right? Yeah. So what I’m searching for on the front end is does this person appear to be a flexible human? Because as soon as I’m convinced that they’re just not a flexible person, it doesn’t make them a bad human, by the way. It just means they’re not flexible. Okay, fine. That’s not the person that I want to invest any more time with because they’re never going to work with me because the thing that I really specialize in is really creative. I’m a creative guy, creative financing,

Speaker 3 (19:50):

Which takes a lot more talking and flexibility. It

Speaker 1 (19:55):

Does. So I got to know that I’m dealing with someone flexible.

Speaker 3 (19:57):

What are the signs when you’re asking people those questions that they’re flexible versus inflexible?

Speaker 1 (20:03):

So I use very open-ended words. So I’ll go ahead and present a possibility of what we could do and the kind of words that, the way that I ask my questions are, would you consider this or would something like this work for you? So it’s not a hard sell. I’m not doing anything that’s hard. So all I’m looking for is feedback. So I may throw something out. For example, I may start a conversation to say, Hey, typically, usually, normally these are very open-ended words. They give me a lot of room to backpedal. If I have to

Speaker 3 (20:31):


Speaker 1 (20:31):

I don’t say, we only do this. I don’t want to cut myself short. Not only do I not want to cut myself short, I really think I can help a lot of people. I don’t want to cut them short if they don’t understand and give me the opportunity to see if I can really help them and at the same time help me and business. So I’m trying to do both things. So I may say something like, yeah, so typically the way we buy is that we would buy owner financing. And all that means is the great downplay. I love explaining it this way. And all that means is it’s a great downplay that I would make a payment to your, that you and I can agree on a number that has to work for you, David. But you know what, David also has to work for me as well, right?


See, I’m always trying to level the playing field. I’m going to make it about you first, but then I weave me into it. Yeah, that’s good. So technically David, the way that we would buy is we would buy owner financing and all that means is is that we would make a monthly payment that we could agree on. Obviously it’s a number that would have to work for you, David, but it’s also a number that has to work for me as well. And so what I wanted to ask you was this, if we can put something together where it makes sense that we could do that and you could take a payment for a period of time, is that something you would consider doing?

Speaker 3 (21:41):

Yeah, of course.

Speaker 1 (21:42):

That’s a great question. So now a person goes, oh, I would never do anything like this in a wait minute. People would never do anything like that. What’s my chance of ever capturing that person’s imagination to then say, Hey, tell me what your mortgage payment is. Tell me what your mortgage, I get a field out at the front end. Is there even any flexibility in that now, even if the person said, yeah, I don’t think I would ever do anything like that. My next question’s always going to be okay. David, is there a concern with that?

Speaker 3 (22:15):

That’s good.

Speaker 1 (22:16):

I’ll tell you what, this is what I learned in my counseling. Yeah, this is counseling really. Now I don’t want to overcomplicate it. You don’t have to be a certified counselor, but I’m saying when you get these rhythms down, this is how you get people to open up if they really are wanting to do something or not. So once I’m convinced the guy or gal I’m talking to is like, no way, man. That’s just never going to happen in my world. A lot of times I’ll actually say, you know what? I think you have me convinced that that probably wouldn’t happen. Yes. Sounds like we may be on a different page. Is that right? So I made a statement and I turned it into a question. Now I’m doing this. I got one foot out the door.

Speaker 3 (22:54):

Right? Yeah.

Speaker 1 (22:55):

It sounds like you and I are not on the same page that you would never want to do anything like this. Is that right? And then that’s going to let me know at that point if they say, yep, you got it right, pal.

Speaker 3 (23:06):

Thank you. We don’t have to waste any more time.

Speaker 1 (23:08):

Yeah, I don’t want to talk about all the other stuff. Yeah, I do that heavy on the front end and I’m doing it relationally just like I tried to illustrate here that it becomes an easy conversation on both sides.

Speaker 3 (23:19):

Yeah, Jesus asked a lot of questions. He dove into it and told a lot of stories, so I feel like there’s a lot to take from

Speaker 1 (23:27):

They were pretty uncomfortable questions though. Sometimes I’d be like,

Speaker 3 (23:30):

Oh yeah. Yes, indeed. So it was like, this is, and sometimes I feel like, do you feel like you ever have to ask uncomfortable questions in the real estate world?

Speaker 1 (23:39):

Oh, sure.

Speaker 3 (23:40):

Oh yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. I really like this because I feel like that’s very practical where if someone’s listening to this, you could take Scott’s little framework. It’s so simple too. That first thing is person flexible or not? You know how you ask or no, you ask questions. Just ask them some simple questions upfront. Setting the framework and those expectations. That was really good. Something else that you said that was really key and we kept going was you say the same things a lot, so it’s like if people were around you, they’d be bored. Like I feel like that’s really good because that’s really good because that you’re saying the same things because they work and that it also helps get to the root cause of what you’re trying to get to. So that way, can I help this person or not? Am I a good fit?


And you’re asking those same questions, so I feel like that’s very key because I think people love to be excited in business and keep things exciting. Some of the most exciting things are the boring things of just get into that rhythm, something that works and ask those right questions. That was the other big thing I took away from this become a master question asker. I don’t know what that book out there, good leaders ask great questions. John Maxwell, there’s so many things out there to help you with that, but I love how you said too, counseling is one of the big things that helped you. Do you think that’s more because it’s just the basic psychology of a human being? Here’s some key things you need to learn. If you’re going to try and have a conversation, especially with someone who’s not open, and you said that you wouldn’t suggest them becoming a counselor, but where can they learn that type of thing if they’re not going to become a counselor, how can you learn to really help a human being open up?

Speaker 1 (25:28):

They have to hang out with me I guess.

Speaker 3 (25:30):

There you go. Hang out with you. That’s a good answer. That takes care of the mentorship and it takes care of the listen to someone else that’s been down the road and who’s a really good question to ask

Speaker 1 (25:39):

Her. I can tell you with my one-on-one clients and they get, in fact, I’m sort of rethinking it these days. They get a lot of access to me and there’s a lot of effort there, but I let them hang over my shoulder so they hear this again and again. One of the hardest things for newer people is when I hang up the phone, we’re 90 seconds into a conversation and I’ve already determined this is not a flexible person, and they’re almost going and saying, I can’t believe you just hung up the phone. There might’ve been a deal there. And I’m like, trust me, there’s not a deal here. But I can’t explain it just by showing it once. We’ve got to do it again. Again, because what are we looking for on the front end? Flexibility. Flexibility.

Speaker 3 (26:18):


Speaker 1 (26:18):

Really what your question was, but where do you find you’ve got to find people that and trust, that have experience and you have confidence that they know how to do what you and I are talking about right now. There’s only one way to do it. You got to hear ’em. You got to see them do it and hear them do it and go, okay, you can’t make this stuff up.


Maybe I could write about it. There’s one thing to write about it. There’s another thing to do it. Oh, here would be a great illustration. I could write about how to ride a bike, right? Say, man, Scott writes so good. I learned how to ride a bike by reading Scott’s book on how to ride a bike. That is not going to teach you much. You don’t read. I think you want to read, but you’re going to get more out of someone that you can have some level of access to. You’ve already used the term like coach or mentor, but someone that’s further down the road than you that has some credibility. You’ve seen them, you’ve heard them, and you’re like, yeah, I could model something like that.

Speaker 3 (27:19):

Yeah, it’s really good. And I think you keep bringing up the words flexibility and trust, and I think that’s where too it’s you get in those situations and those questions really help you know that I’m not here just to tell you something. I’m here to really dig in of what’s going on. And then if you’re taking those people down the road too that are the people that are following you and trying to learn as well too, it’s really getting them to know, to know what’s going on to then that process and trust that process. Not just you, but then that whole process you’re taking ’em through. Those seem like big words in your life, flexible, like and trust. Some of the things that I think are very foundational too, especially if you’re going to be in the real estate world and talking with sellers and the people out there that haven’t gone through all of this and don’t know this world and don’t know all that. That’s very helpful because I think those are very key takeaways that people can actually, actually use. In the last final minutes here, I just wanted to see is there any other advice that you would want to give the real estate investing community listening to this, and then we’ll point him to where people can find you.

Speaker 1 (28:28):

If you knew the people who knew me, they’re like, you’re giving Scott like two minutes. This guy, I could go for an hour on this, right? There’s so much flooding that’s coming out of me here, but I would first say, you’ve got to have enough willingness to hang in there if you’re new at this, and even if you’re not, by the way, I’ve been doing this now for a while. I don’t know what your experience is even with what you do. There are bumps in the road still along the way that


We got to keep reminding ourselves, man, look at where I am now. And when I look back, I go, man, a year ago I was way over there, but look at where I am now. And by the way, anyone listening, if you look back at the last year and you go, well, I don’t have that. I’m right where I was a year ago, you probably really want to listen to what we’re talking about here. So I would say don’t give up. Surround yourself certainly with good people, people that have your interest in mind. I know I’ve already said that one of the things that at least the skill base that I bring, I’ve worked very, very hard to remove all permission language out of my vernacular. That takes a little bit of practice, but once you get it, it’s very different now in how you approach. In my case would be either a seller or a buyer. I also work with buyers in long-term relationships as well. Can you explain

Speaker 3 (29:44):

That? Removing permission language, what would be an example of that with a seller

Speaker 1 (29:48):

Buyer? So I’ll do one with just a voice message or a text message that I would leave. What I don’t ever want to do is come off salesy because I know how I react to salesy where our culture is right now. Anything that smells salesy, even though we want to buy, even though we want to sell, if we feel any level of pressure, we don’t want to deal with it. And by the way, I don’t want to be, even if it worked, I don’t want to be that guy. I’m not that guy. I’m not cutting that clause. If we can get there through connection and relationship, that’s how I want to do it. Okay, so removing permission language. So it goes to voicemail. I say, hi, David. Hey, I was just calling about my interest in buying your house over at 1, 2, 3 Main Street. Sorry, we didn’t connect right now.


I was hoping that you and I could connect today. Hey, you know what, David? I almost interrupt myself. You know what, David? I’m going to go ahead and text you as well to see if we can get on a call real quick today. Okay? Yeah, thanks. I look forward to chatting with you soon. Click I hang up. There was no permission in that. I’m telling him I’m calling. I’m going to text you so that we can get on a call today. Okay. Then I text very, very similar. I actually talk into my phone. This, I mean, I get carpal tunnel now. I got so much to say into the phone, Hey David, I just left you a voicemail message. I was calling about my interest in buying your house. You may have someone right now going, but Scott, what? I don’t want to buy that house.


But when you see it and you go, oh, I’m not buying this crappy house, then don’t buy it. Don’t worry about it. But do that to get them on the phone. And all I say is, David, are you available now for a quick call question mark? I look forward to chatting with you soon. Thanks, Scott. The next day I’m calling back. I want to do the same thing, but all permission language is out in that. I’m basically saying, this is what I’m expecting you to call me. That’s really doing, when I’m talking about the price of someone’s house or if I want to ask what their mortgage balance is, I don’t say, Hey, is it okay with you that you kind of share maybe your mortgage balance with the answer to That’s going to be no. I can’t tell you last time. I’m going to note to that question.


I just come in and say, okay, hey, so tell me I like to give choices. Hey, tell me, is there debt on the property like a mortgage or is it free and clear? And inevitably, in most cases there is a mortgage, they’ll no, there’s a mortgage. I say, okay, great. So when you make that mortgage payment, do you pay your taxes and insurance together with it or do you pay it separately? You and I probably know that 90% of people pay it together, but this is so I can get the number. They’re going to answer the question. Oh no, I pay it together. Oh, okay. And about how much is that? There’s no permission in that. Hey, David, is it okay with you that you share with me your mortgage payment that’s asking permission, David, when you make your payment, do you pay it this way or that way? Oh, I pay it this way. Oh, okay. And about how much is that? Oh, it’s that much. Oh, okay. I got you.

Speaker 3 (32:40):

Yeah. Oh, that’s really good. And that’s the difference between asking questions and asking good questions. So I like that. That’s so much to learn from here. I love that you gave hang in there. Don’t give up. Remove that permission language and really just set those expectations, which is really good. That was really good stuff. So if people want to, because I feel like even now I want more of Scott. So what if people want more of you? You do the one-on-one, you do the different things. Talk about that and how people can connect with you.

Speaker 1 (33:10):

I probably would say the best way to connect is just go over to my Facebook. I’m posting all the time, I little, I do reels and some videos. I’m always giving content. I’m always giving stuff like this. Examples of conversations I’ve already had. Sometimes they’re with other students, they’re with sellers. I even invite people in on live seller calls, so you can actually call me on

Speaker 3 (33:31):

Phone. That’s

Speaker 1 (33:32):

Awesome. Very interactive. And so they could go over to Facebook, check me out there. So it’s My Deal, Inc. That’s all they got to put in on Facebook. If you forget that, just put my name in and then you can go to my regular Facebook and then you can link to it from there.

Speaker 3 (33:45):

Cool. So they can either find you on Facebook via your personal page or My Deal, Inc. If they go there. And is it Inc INC or INK?

Speaker 1 (33:54):

It’s INC. Oh, that’s a good question.

Speaker 3 (33:56):

There you go. Yeah, he could go either way. So I like that. That’s good stuff. So if you want more of Scott, head over to Facebook. Look him up there content, so that way you can know. I can trust him too. Then you could see him doing his stuff right there and then see if you want to move forward from there. That’s really good. Scott, this has been awesome. This is a lot of practical value from, I love how you gave the second deal hiccup and all the lessons learned from there. Don’t know what you don’t know, and you’re saved from getting the people that actually do know, so you get that help. I also thought too, the flexibility. That was a huge one. And then the know, like, and trust. Hang in there. Don’t give up and remove that permission language. So lots of stuff learned today, lots of nuggets.


So head over to his Facebook page to connect with him. If you’re out there thinking too, like, what the heck? I have no idea what’s going on in my business or what’s going on, especially with the financial department. Where’s all my money going? I don’t know what I don’t know. We can save you years of your life. So go to simple cfo.com and we can put a CFO on your team and help you get to where you know what you make, spend and keep because you need to keep more of it. That’s what we do, and that’s what we’d love to help you do. And head over to simple cfo.com. Scott, thanks again for being on this podcast and for coming on and just sharing all the wisdom that you did today,

Speaker 1 (35:11):

Man. Thanks. Hey. Hey. Second deal was not a hiccup. It was an implosion. It

Speaker 3 (35:14):

Was an implosion. It was a big hiccup. It was a hiccup that lasted years that also gave you lots of indigestion, it sounds like, but I’m glad you worked through it and that you found a lot all the lessons through it, which I think is really good because how we react to things versus going through them. So I think you handled it very well. But this has been great, Scott. Thank you so much for all that you shared today. You got it. Yep. Thanks.

Speaker 2 (35:40):

This episode of The Profit First for REI podcast is over, but there are plenty more where that came from. Are you ready to learn how David and his team can help implement the Profit First system in your business? Schedule a discovery call@simplecfo.com right now. We’ll see you next time on The Profit First for REI podcast with David Richter.

Title: “Realize Your REI Potential with Jennifer Steward: Authenticity, Profitability, and Consistency”

Episode: 240

In this episode of Profit First for REI podcast, we are sitting down with Jennifer Steward of REI Data Source, to unveil the secret weapon you’ve been missing: authenticity. 

Jen will crack the code on how to project a winning image that seals the deal…But wait, there’s more! Learn the top revenue activities every entrepreneur should master and discover the power of consistent strategies to solve your REI problems.

This episode is your blueprint to a thriving virtual business. Don’t miss out!

Key Takeaways:

[0:50] Introducing Jennifer Steward

[6:07] Project an image of success from

time to time

[9:16] Some best revenue activities that every entrepreneur should know

[11:00] Leveraging every avenue that you can, get consistency, and make sure you’re solving current problems

[17:43] The golden ratio in social media marketing is: 90% business and 10% personal

[25:02] The benefits of running a virtual business


[4:20] “Authenticity is like a business repellant.”

[10:09]  “In a market where you can’t dind deals but there’s plenty of money, you have to be the person who knows how to find the deals.” 

Connect with Jennifer:

REI Data Source Website: https://www.reidatasource.net 

Jen’s Email: jen@reidatasource.net 

Phone Number: (469) 952-8011

Tired of living deal to deal? 

If you are a real estate investor or business owner who is tired of living deal to deal and want to double your profits, head over here to book your no-obligation discovery call with me. Either myself or someone from my team will hop on a short call with you to get clear on your business goals, remove any obstacles holding you back, and map out a game plan to help you finally start keeping more of the money you work so hard to make. – David


Speaker 1 (00:00):

You need to just be able to solve the seller’s problem and just start with one exit strategy that you’re really confident in. And then once you master that, expand from there. And like you and I talked about, it’s who not how you don’t have time. Most likely to master all of those. So have a referral partner that you can build a relationship with and trust.

Speaker 2 (00:23):

If you’re a real estate investor who’s sick and tired of living deal to deal, then welcome home. Hear from everyday real estate investors just like you, and discover how they’ve completely transformed their business by taking a profit First approach. This is the profit first for REI podcast, where we believe revenue is vanity. Profit is sanity. It’s time to start making profit a habit in your business. So here’s your host, David Richter.

Speaker 3 (00:50):

Today we have Jennifer Stewart on which she is a go-getter. She’s out there, she’s doing lots of things. She’s in the cold calling space. She’s also a real estate investor. But then she’s also someone who I think has gone through a lot in her life and has come out on the other side stronger. And you can tell just from what she talks about and what she sees as the most successful real estate investors, what they do on a daily basis, on a monthly basis, it’s just good bottom line stuff to help you if you want to become someone who’s consistent in business, no matter what the market is doing. So I think this is going to be a really good episode. She gets into the nitty gritty and also just helping you get to where you want to be and making more money as a entrepreneur. Jennifer, welcome to the Profit First REI podcast. I’m so excited you’re here today.

Speaker 1 (01:37):

David, thank you so much for having me. I’ve been looking forward to this all weekend. What a great way to spend a Tuesday at noon and thank you. Thank you so much for having me today.

Speaker 3 (01:47):

Yeah, well I’m excited because we dance around in these different groups and we’re going to these events and you’re speaking a lot, you’re helping a lot of people out there, and I see you as someone who’s just very much, I hope this comes across, but just a very mature human being that has gone through a lot, but you haven’t just been a victim. You’ve been someone who said, I’m going to grow from what I’ve gone through, and that’s what I’ve just observed. And then honestly, there’s lots of my friends that respect you a lot too. I’ve gotten to know you well, so I’m excited about this one. So many things that I feel like we could go down, lots of roads here. So again, thank you for being on the show.

Speaker 1 (02:25):

I appreciate that. That’s very generous and kind observation. I think mature is a very polite word and I am just kind of overwhelmed with that kind assessment.

Speaker 3 (02:37):

Yeah, well, I don’t want to use any rude words for you here today, so we’re going to dive into it. No, but seriously I do. I see as someone who takes a lot of those lessons and applies them right away. I would also say too that you are not scared about sharing what you’ve learned and what you’ve gone through. Where do you get that deep sense of truth to share exactly what’s going on? And I don’t know if you’re a fan of the office or if you’ve ever seen that show. I like the Office, if you like the office. Where is it? I think it’s Kelly’s, Dayton, Daryl, and she says, he said, who says exactly what they’re thinking? What kind of game is that? And I’m like, that is Jennifer to a t. And I’m just wondering how did you get that as part of you? Because I think it’s so genuine, authentic, and it brings more people to you and they resonate. You’re saying what they’re scared to say.

Speaker 1 (03:30):

My business advisors have told me to do the opposite. They said

Speaker 3 (03:36):

Genuine, sorry. That’s great. Basically the

Speaker 1 (03:38):

More money you’re going to make, you have to play the game. And so what I’ll do, David being totally transparent, is I’ll turn that on and off depending on my revenue. So I know that sounds hilarious probably, but if my revenue gets lower, I will turn off the authenticity to a certain extent and go back into my polite game, the system mode. But whenever income is plentiful, I’ll go back to being more my authentic sharing self because number one, sometimes I get more business than I can possibly ever take down, and that’s overwhelming. And so I find that authenticity is like a business repellent, but it’s so much, it’s so stressful for me to be fake. It’s so stressful for me to be something I’m not. And that’s me being a little bit funny, but also kind of realistic as a business woman. And then there’s me as a person who has a soul and that person wants to connect. That person realizes that I’m not just here to make money, I am here to help people who are suffering. And I know that sounds cheesy and cliche, but it’s true. And lemme tell you, I don’t want to be one of those people who are suffering. So I will switch into a mode that is more polished, if that makes sense.

Speaker 3 (05:09):

That makes sense.

Speaker 1 (05:10):

Because I don’t want to starve. And so I do kind of go back and forth between, okay, I need to dial it back. And I think that people notice that if I was just all the time talking about what a person can overcome or the deep parts of our why and our feelings, then I think that would really drive away a lot of business. I’ve seen people who got up on stage and talked about aligning the chakras and they were never invited back. So you have to find a balance between being a compelling human who helps people overcome these internal struggles that we likely all face, especially as entrepreneurs, depression, anxiety, slow times debt overhead, really painful things that will keep up at night and destroy your health and destroy your relationships. And then we also need to focus on, unfortunately we have to project an image of success from time to time because I’ll tell you, I always get the most business whenever I’m on vacation, I can actively ask people to leave me alone while I’m on vacation.


And that’s whenever I get all the messages for, Hey, I want to do business with you. Because they see the success, they see that it works. When really that’s I’m spending the money, that’s whenever I’m the least successful because I’m not putting time into my business and the dollars are just flying out the window like someone who has an open wound. And so it’s funny because it’s whenever you’re doing the best that it doesn’t show, and whenever I’m making the most money, it’s usually whenever I look the worst, I haven’t had time to groom myself. I’m probably still wearing pajamas that day. And so it’s almost always the opposite as to who has money and who doesn’t. So the person you see with the super nice house and the super nice car, those people have confided in me, Hey, I have so much pressure, I feel like I’m going to lose it.


But those are the people that look up to and respect. And so that being said, David, if I was financially independent, 100% I would be genuine and deep and all the time, if that makes sense. It would be like, Hey, when you woke up today, did you thank God for just waking up? And what are some ways that you can lower your overhead? What are some ways you can increase revenue? Are you wasting time on non-revenue generating activities? Are you doing too much stuff for free? Those of us who are in real estate, I think we do too many things for free. And like you and I talked about, it’s not just your expenditures that are on your books, it’s also the expenditures that are on your time. And so I talked to my attorney last week about dropping non-revenue generating businesses that just aren’t converting because there’s hope in one hand and there’s numbers in the other.


And after a certain amount of time, you need to realize which businesses are covering for the businesses that are taking a loss. And so my lawyer kind of sat me down and I know you do this, and we had to look at which businesses are just not generating and which are carrying the ones that aren’t. And he said, just focus on the ones that are. And so that being said, whenever we wake up every day, if we are our real selves all day, it usually doesn’t translate into revenue. But when I have the luxury of being myself, David, I always want to reduce the suffering of others because that’s kind of all I’ve done my whole life is I’ve had to overcome and overcome and overcome and overcome to a degree that just feels, it could feel really unlucky if I let myself go there. But instead of feeling unlucky, I have to see the opposite side of it. So for all the extremely low probability things that happened to me, there’s also extreme low probability things that happened for me. And you have to see both.

Speaker 3 (09:11):

Right. That’s really good. That is really good. So since we’ve gone down this road, and especially for the real estate investors listening, what would you say are some of the best revenue producing activities they could be doing or that you see in your own life that you do that translates into that

Speaker 1 (09:29):

You have to fill a niche that nobody else is filling? You have to see a problem that everyone is facing a hitch in the giddy up that’s keeping everyone from making money. What I’m noticing right now, for example, people don’t have the money for down payments on their loans. So like we mentioned before the call, I’m offering a program where you can do a hundred percent financing as long as you’re one of my cold calling clients. And it blew up because people don’t have the money for a down payment right now, and my cold callers really aren’t that expensive. And so it solves that problem for them. And in the past, the biggest problem was finding deals. And in a market where you can’t find deals, but there’s plenty of money, then you have to be the person who knows how to find the deals.


And so you have to find what’s keeping people from making money today in the current market and then really, really leverage your social media and go speak, like you and I talked about before, go speak on those topics, mention it on social media, put it in your stories, tell people what you do, and then be really consistent with your message because people are watching, they want to see consistency. And it’s like my lawyer taught me, who’s Jeff Watson? If they see you being erratic and all over the place and not consistent in your message, then people don’t trust that they can go to you to solve these problems. And so that’s the big key is leveraging your social media and being really consistent in your message and making sure that you’re solving the problems of today. So those three things, consistency, solving the current problems and just making sure that you’re leveraging pretty much every avenue that you can.


And of course, always want to be competent and run an ethical business because you can spend 10 years building a reputation. And if you hire one bad employee or someone who makes you look bad or doesn’t deliver for a client, unfortunately bad news spreads like wildfire and just whatever you’re buying on Amazon, you’re going to pay more attention to the bad review than the good reviews because we’re looking for to avoid pain for good reasons. I mean, some things could take us out and set us back a decade if we make the wrong investment. And so it’s really, really important in a capital intensive business what we’re in to be someone who’s trustworthy, competent with very high integrity. Like you and I talked last week and I told you, I was like, Hey, I can’t be consulting on a topic that I don’t know about. Thank you for the inquiry. But that would be horribly unethical. And you have to do that. You have to turn down the fast money for the long-term play of having high integrity.

Speaker 3 (12:18):

Yeah, no, a hundred percent. That’s really good. I think that’s consistency, solving the problem for today and then getting the message out. So those are three steps there. And I think that’s where it’s like, it’s so simple, but it’s like that number one, you got to do it consistently and you got to move to where the market is. So I think that’s really good stuff because I can’t agree more because I think, do you think that a lot of real estate investors build themselves into a box and then when that solving the problem of what they used to do doesn’t solve it anymore, that they have a hard time pivoting to something that will and bring the revenue? Yeah,

Speaker 1 (12:57):

I mean you have your fast movers, your highly networked people who are poised to move, but for anyone who doesn’t want to hustle 24 7, it’s hard to pivot like that. I mean, at some point, I think human beings, we all want consistency, predictability. And one thing that’s really tough about this business, and I’m sure everyone notices, is how fast paced it really is. Now, if we were in the paper business, for example, David, how much do you think things change? Speaking of office space or not office space, the

Speaker 3 (13:35):

Office office,

Speaker 1 (13:36):

Yeah, yeah. I mean if we’re a paper company, how often do you think the industry changes? Right.

Speaker 3 (13:42):

It doesn’t really change. I don’t know.

Speaker 1 (13:44):

I mean maybe a paper guy comes and messages us and said, oh, you wouldn’t believe.


But it seems like from the outside looking in that real estate, every day there’s some new gimmicky stuff and you’re just like, I can’t handle this. I need to step away because I can’t handle one more gimmick. I can’t handle one more big change. It’s difficult. And so I think knowing the fundamentals, because I know people who make big money just using a yellow pad for their CRMs still, and some of these people are big names, and I don’t think he’d mind me saying, Adam Johnson, Leon Johnson’s son, he does a lot of deals just using a yellow pad. Courtney Frickey, she has her paper leads that she keeps in a file and only goes through them if she needs to. So a lot of these gimmicks just really aren’t the real deal. The real deal is not necessarily what software you’re using, it’s where are we in the market, are there more deals than money or is there more money than deals?


Those are really the main two shifts that if you pay attention to those in the market, you’re good. And people was like, oh, I do this with AI and I do that with ai. I haven’t seen AI do anything really amazing except for Google search type stuff. I mean, I’ve listened to the AI calls and they’re still not that great yet. And I keep hearing people say, oh, AI is going to be doing our acquisition management soon. Well, yes, true, but when I haven’t seen it yet and still, which problem is it solving the low money problem or the low inventory problem? And right now I think it’s market to market. It’s kind of like mushrooms and in certain markets we still have an inventory problem and other markets are more of a buyer’s market and we have more of a money problem. So you have to take it market by market, city by city and see which problem are you solving. Those are really the main two problems in real estate. And what I’ve seen is everything else is a marketing gimmick. As someone who does marketing myself, we try to repackage it to get people’s attention, but it’s kind of all the same stuff.

Speaker 3 (15:59):

Yeah, no, that makes sense. So would you say then the people like Adam and the people like Courtney, are those three things that you mentioned before consistent solve the problem for today and then the media and the messaging is that their key to success and as long as they’re consistent doing, what’s really is that or is there something that makes them different just because they go out there, and I love how you said with their CRM is a yellow legal pad, it’s none of the fancy stuff and all that where a lot of people get trapped in that rabbit hole. So that’s where my I’m wondering, yeah,

Speaker 1 (16:31):

Courtney’s really consistent on Instagram and she gets a lot of referrals. And Adam’s been in his market for 20 years, so he gets a lot of referrals. So you talk about consistency, it’s decades of consistency in Adam’s case, and Courtney has been doing it I think for 10 years, and she really gets out there in terms of, she speaks in front of realtors groups, she speaks at rhe, she holds her radio show, and she’s very consistent in her branding. She doesn’t just show herself boating on the weekend or shopping or whatever. And if you look back through her Instagram, you can see that in the past she did have more of showing her personal life. And Connor Steinbrook taught me, don’t show your personal life, just make your entire page about business. But there is one caveat to that. You don’t want to look like one of those VA generated pages where there’s no real person behind it.

Speaker 3 (17:23):


Speaker 1 (17:24):

Looks like a VA just runs my page and it’s just my VA who does everything. So I do post pictures of my family and going to the gym, and if I do go on vacation, I do post that. But too much of it makes people think you’re not available for business. So I would say the golden ratio that I’ve discovered is about 90% business and 10% personal, just to add that speckle of reality that you are a real person and not a va. And I think Courtney does that very well on her Instagram for example, and she doesn’t even have to spend money on marketing. She told me she doesn’t do that anymore. She’s a hundred percent referral based now and it’s taken being consistent

Speaker 3 (18:04):

And she does a lot of creative deals or that’s all she does is the creative type deals. She

Speaker 1 (18:10):

Does kind of everything. I know her to do flips, I know her to do. She’s mostly a buy and hold investor and she will do creative when she needs to. But I think I’ve had a lot of clients come to me over the years and try to curate a marketing plan where all we do is creative for them. And that is really tough. You’re going to have a low ratio of being able to do that. Typically creative should be something that comes organically from time to time. If you make that your only goal, and this was a guy with a lot of money, by the way, the one I’m thinking of. He had so much money, yet he was super focused on just doing creative. And I understand if someone has no money and they’re just focused on doing creative, but they get it in their head that this is the way to do it and there is no the way to do it.


You have to just solve the problem of the current seller who wants to sell, whether it’s a listing, whether it’s innovation, whether it’s a flip, whether it’s a wholesale, whether it’s long-term buying hold subject to seller finance, and anything else I’m missing in there. It shouldn’t just be, oh, I’m going to pull this list and I’m just going to do ovations or I’m going to do this campaign. I’m just going to do subject two. You need to just be able to solve the seller’s problem and just start with one, this is something I’ve taught for years. Just start with one exit strategy that you’re really competent in. And then once you master that, expand from there, and like you and I talked about, it’s who not how you don’t have time most likely to master all of those. So have a referral partner that you can build a relationship with and trust for innovations for subject to maybe even for seller financing or maybe master two, but mastering all of the above would be insanity. Even if you had been doing this for 50 years like Leon Johnson, that would be insanity. So be ready to leverage joint venture partners that you can trust with the right paperwork behind it. Of course.

Speaker 3 (20:02):

Would you say that if you go down that road, can you build a business like that? Meaning where a business is systems and other people where eventually you have a business that runs itself or runs it with the people in the processes you’ve put in place. It seems like with real estate, like you’re saying, I have to solve the seller’s problem right then and there. So it almost sounds like you need at those higher level people, you can’t just get the McDonald’s line worker that’s there or the robot or AI or something like that. That’s

Speaker 1 (20:33):

The challenge that I’ve run into. And I feel like conceptually it can be done, but then in psychology we have something called channel factors, these little things that get in the way of what sounds good on paper. And that’s usually where the human element comes in because I have staff of 180 people in my agency and I’ve learned little tricks to managing them. For example, this is going to sound weird, I don’t do company meetings because I just meet with them as I need to. I do spend a lot of time with them upfront, maybe a few hours, and then I never talk to them again except to tell them when a job has come in. And if they need more than that, they’re probably not a good fit. And I don’t do group meetings because I’ve had them all group up against me in the past to raise wages, basically wanting to unionize whenever my clients can’t afford that.


And I said, I’ll let the whole company burn down before I let you extort me in this way. And I did. And I did it privately. I didn’t tell anyone. I didn’t go public about it, but I just stopped the company for six months and just traveled. And it’s like I have plenty of money. And then they were suffering. And then once I was done traveling, they were like, Jen, please, please, I’ll come back. So who would think that there’s a human variable of needing to stop people from organizing against you, or it’s like Adam Johnson says, you have to make sure that you’re always in the way of a deal in order to get it done. So that’s why you can’t fully replace yourself for the most part unless you sell the company, is because at some point somewhere you need to add value. And yes, you can have an integrator, and yes, you can have a CEO, and yes, you can have a CFO, et cetera, but if you notice even in a C class corporation, you still have shareholders.


The shareholders are still in the way in some way because they own a part of the company. So no matter what, you have to make sure that you’re in the way of other people just taking over completely what you do and just pushing you out. And so that is the challenge. That’s where replacing, that’s what no one talks about. Everyone wants to sell these sexy business models where you’re just on the beach or whatever, but at some point you have to put yourself between yourself and someone else to make sure you’re still adding value or you’re just going to get pushed out. So another example is, I mean, you can just live like my older gentleman, friends who just own a bunch of mutual funds and they don’t manage anything. They just collect checks from the dividends, but you have to have millions in order to achieve that.


Lemme tell you, those are the people who have the most passive income that I’ve seen, and I know this is an REI podcast, but what’s great about real estate is you can start with a relatively small amount of money and then with appreciation, leverage that into millions, and then you can become the mutual fund, the note owner or your kids can get your portfolio, but it’s not as passive as just having your mutual fund dividends come in and as know the stock market goes up and down where rents typically, there’s not as much fluctuation in rents as there is in the stock market. And so all that being said, going back to what you asked, whenever you’re managing staff, there’s just going to be all these psychological factors that are not going to present themselves on paper with your staff is always the biggest challenge in running a company.


And so that’s why I don’t do company meetings because that’s whenever people get together, and pardon my language, I think it’s a poignant word. They start bitching and then that causes morale issues. All it takes is one person to start griping and then morale goes way down. And I don’t care how well you run your company, I don’t care if you are like you have in the background, I don’t care if you’re Mr. Rogers, as soon as someone starts griping and it takes hold, it’s game over. This doesn’t work if you run a brick and mortar business. But I have doctor friends, for example. They run brick and mortar businesses, and one of my doctor’s friends two weeks ago, his entire staff just walked out. They’ve been with them for 20 years and they couldn’t have organized like that if you keep them separate. If you’re running a virtual business, that’s one of the benefits is you can manage your staff. And I tell you, that has made my income extremely passive.


So if you take nothing else away from this by keeping my staff separated, I have generated true passive income for myself because all I do is bring the jobs, bring the clients, they work the clients, and then they do a good job and then I’m out. The only thing I have to do is keep bringing in new clients because there is always going to be some small amount of attrition no matter how good of a job you do for various reasons. So yeah, if you have a virtual business, keep your staff separate and that way they’re not coming together. And it’s amazing how peaceful things are. I have no drama. I have no complaints. I’ve known go well. so-and-so did this, and so-and-so said this, and so-and-so gets paid this and I want to get paid this. It’s like I have literally zero drama in my agency with my staff now, and that has just been amazing.

Speaker 3 (26:03):

Yeah, that’s the first time I’ve heard it put like that of keeping separate in that you don’t run meetings and you don’t get them together, which is very anti, a lot of the books out there and a lot of those systems and stuff that have the organizational meetings and that type of stuff, level 10 meetings or the level 10 meetings and all that, that goes along with it. So I love hearing a contrarian viewpoint, especially for someone who runs a virtual business like that and who’s gone through almost like you said, the utilization of that type of stuff. Yeah, I’ve been this for

Speaker 1 (26:37):

Six years, and so that’s enough time to where you’ve passed some task, kissed a lot of frogs and had every problem under the sun.

Speaker 3 (26:44):

Yeah, yeah, no kidding. So that’s very interesting. Well, this has been a lot of fun. I love the answers that you’ve given. I think there’s some really good value there too with being consistent, solving today’s problem and getting it out there, being consistent of getting out your message as well too. I also like that what you just went over that was so contrary to what other people say. That was really an interesting take. I want to, and I

Speaker 1 (27:10):

Would bet you my headaches are much smaller than theirs,

Speaker 3 (27:14):

Probably. Probably. I mean, well, most people have the headaches in business, and if you just have less than them that it probably wouldn’t take much if you just had just that many less. So that’s great. I love hearing that. What I wanted to talk

Speaker 1 (27:29):

Authentic draws better clients too. I did want to share that because I know I went on a bit of a rant and a ramble about that, but let me be pointing on one point is that by being my real self, David against my business advisor’s advice, the clients I have now, I have no drama with and I don’t know why I’m not smart enough, I guess to know why. But the ones who come to me whenever I’m going through times of being very authentic and just really sharing whatever it is, whatever business problems or personal problems that I may be facing and how I’m overcoming them, I get so many people, like you said, who may not do business immediately and it scares off a lot of people. But the clients who do come to me, we have no problems, no drama. They don’t blame me for a lack of success.


They just come in, show up, close their deals, and they stay long-term customers. So that is one benefit is I get fewer clients, but the ones that I do get, I have zero drama with, and we’re so simpatico that I work hard to make sure they’re successful and they don’t. Whenever I was being inauthentic and getting a lot more clients, we don’t have meetings about Jennifer, why am I spending this money and not getting any deals and then this, and they’re just being very nitpicky, but clients where I’m my authentic self, they come in and they just close deals, David, we don’t have to have awkward meetings that make me feel like crap about myself, feeling like I’m not really actually helping anyone and I’m just charging money and nothing’s happening for them. They come in and they’re like, Hey, Jen, I did this deal. I did this deal. Your staff is great. And so that was a crazy change to me. I thought, this is self-destructive behavior being this authentic, but I just felt compelled to actually help people. And then these clients are the most low maintenance clients I’ve ever had. So I would be curious what your take is on that in terms of why is it being authentic? First off, it’s interesting. It draws in less clients, but the ones that does draw in, I have zero drama, zero problems with, and they stay with me forever,

Speaker 3 (29:36):

Which is funny because what you’re describing now is in those books that tell you to have the meetings, it’s like it’s your core values. It’s the values that are shining through that. It’s people that resonate with you as a human being. So usually they’re going to be the ones, especially if you’re being authentic and being open and honest and sharing values that are just as a society, we look at and say, it’s mature what you’re doing. You draw those mature people in, so it’s like they’re going to be the ones that sit back, they do the deals, they get it done, and then they come to you and they be like, yeah, let’s keep moving forward. And that’s the low drama because projecting that out there as well too, just from what I can observe right there. But I really like that because very much of if you’re going to be yourself, you might bring in less, but you might bring more of the people that you want to work with. That’s what I took away from makes income

Speaker 1 (30:26):

More passive because that is always my goal. Low drama staff, low drama clients where we’re just doing deals. I’m providing excellent staff who are going to make sure that you’re getting in front of as many people as possible for as little money as possible, talking to those motivated sellers, getting good prices on data, getting good prices on your loans to close your deals, and just keep it simple. There shouldn’t be any insanity. There shouldn’t be a lot of complaints and craziness. And that’s not to say there’s never problems, but when there are, it’s like, Hey, Jen, we need to have a meeting because this caller’s gotten a little too lax and they’re just becoming too rote and they’re going through the motions too much. I had to have that call three months ago, but guess what? He didn’t leave. He didn’t blame. He said, Hey, let’s just fix, let’s just fix their script.


And so I told her, I said, Hey, you’re one of my best, and maybe you’re working too long hours. Maybe you need to take more breaks. Maybe we need to load you up with fewer clients because instead of listening to the seller, you are kind of just pushing through the script. I said, someone who started out cold calling myself, I noticed I would do that towards the end of my shift. And I said, so let’s just be aware that that’s what’s going on. But I didn’t blame or shame her. I just said, Hey, because I was sitting in that seat myself for so many years, David is a cold caller. I know what problems they face, and it makes me a better manager for them. And just say, Hey, it just sounds like you’re getting a little tired. And so take a 30 minute nap, take an hour nap and come back and you’ll see how all of a sudden, instead of just pushing through a script, you’re really an active listener.


But that’s the only problem client meeting I had to have in the last six months where before God, David, it seemed like it was every day. People were just pinging me with this is a problem and that’s a problem. This is a problem. And I think that’s what led to my heart attack last year at 38 years old, was just having all these clients with all these complaints and it was just driving me crazy. And now I don’t have any of that. And so just sharing my experience, whether it’s true or false or somewhere in between. It’s just my anecdotal experience.

Speaker 3 (32:36):

Well, no, that’s really good. I wish we more time, but I’m going to land the plane here. We’ll have to do another episode too about how you got through that and coming out on the other side. But if people want to get ahold of you for your cold calling and what you’re doing there and how would they get ahold of you if they want to start to work with

Speaker 1 (32:54):

You? Yeah, whether it’s the cold calling or like I said, the loans where we’re offering a hundred percent financing on both the rehab and purchase price. If they’re my cold calling client, they can just email me at jen, JEN at rre I data source.net. I’m also a really brave person who gives out my cell phone because as a cold caller, I’m not afraid to call you. You

Speaker 3 (33:18):

Can call me,

Speaker 1 (33:19):

I may think you’re a spam call and answer a little bit briskly, but my cell phone is (469) 952-8011. Feel free to call me there or Jen at REI data source.net.

Speaker 3 (33:32):

Cool. So that’s how you could get ahold of Jen, and that’s the email. And she gave your phone number as well too, so you could call her in and say, Hey, hey, just wanted to see if you answer the phone. I’m sure you will. Like you said, who does that? Right? Who? Their cell phone. Cell phone. And then who does that? And then actually answers too. I feel like today’s age, please go to voicemail. So that was good stuff. Lots of valuable information here, stuff that you could take and I think implement right away to become these type of people out there that are consistently successful. And that’s one of their keys to success is being consistent in solving today’s problem, building the message around that as well too. I really liked your insight of the type of client you draw in when you are your authentic self versus where you might get more, but it might be more headaches if you are not. So it’s like just lots of good practical things today. So that was a lot of good stuff. Thank you for sharing, Jen. I really appreciate all that you did here today.

Speaker 1 (34:26):

I appreciate it. David, thank you so much for having, thanks for asking great questions.

Speaker 3 (34:30):

And I wanted to say too, if you’re listening to this and you’re like, oh my gosh, I’m not making enough or whatever, first of all, call Jen, you can literally call her. She gave you her number. She can help you make more money if you need to keep the money too. If you’re like, I have no idea where my money’s going, don’t know what my overhead is, don’t know how much I’m making, how much I’m keeping, or I want to keep more, you can reach out to us@simplecfo.com. We want to help you get at least that stuff in place because if you don’t have any idea, you’re not running a business. So that’s where I want to help you at least be consistent in knowing where your money’s going too. That’s another consistency factor as well too there. But Jen, again, thank you so much for coming on and sharing, and if there’s anything that you need from Jen, you know how to get ahold of her. She gave you the email address and her phone number. Again, thank you so much for coming on today.

Speaker 2 (35:17):

This episode of The Profit First for REI podcast is over, but there are plenty more where that came from. Are you ready to learn how David and his team can help implement the Profit First system in your business? Schedule a discovery call@simplecfo.com right now. We’ll see you next time on The Profit First for REI podcast with David Richter.