How to Save Big on Taxes: Practical Advice from Shauna, the Tax Goddess

Title: “How to Save Big on Taxes: Practical Advice from Shauna, the Tax Goddess”

Episode: 238

In this episode of the Profit First for REI podcast, we have Shauna, the Tax Goddess. Shauna is a highly sought-after Tax Strategist who helps successful business owners, entrepreneurs, and high-wage earners reduce their tax burden.

If you need practical advice on keeping more money in your pocket and not paying too much tax, Shauna has a wealth of knowledge! 

In this episode, she shares ways to save money on taxes and more ways to increase your profitability. Enjoy the show!

Key Takeaways:

[00:55] Introducing Shauna the Tax Goddess

[01:45] ‘The Tax Goddess’

[03:18] How did she become a tax strategist?

[07:25] Ordinary, necessary, reasonable

[12:28] Different tax strategies

[17:29] What is your aggression scale?

[19:51] Specific tips for real estate investors

[25:45] Performance vs Culture

[28:40] Connect with Shauna, The Tax Goddess


[10:49] “A lot of what you do as a business owner, you need to run through this filter of ordinary, necessary, and reasonable to determine if for you and what you are doing, you believe that you need those three.”

[16:24] “Which strategy will be the best depends on what you as a taxpayer want for you, your family, and your wife.”

[18:09] “Your aggression scale will determine which strategies you can use or don’t use.”

Connect with Shauna:

Website: https://taxgoddess.com/ 

Tired of living deal to deal? 

If you are a real estate investor or business owner who is tired of living deal to deal and want to double your profits, head over here to book your no-obligation discovery call with me. Either myself or someone from my team will hop on a short call with you to get clear on your business goals, remove any obstacles holding you back, and map out a game plan to help you finally start keeping more of the money you work so hard to make. – David


Speaker 1 (00:00):

So we start then looking at layering these much bigger strategies. So great example is the 8 31 B, captive insurance. Ryan, you can put away tying us back to profit first. You can put away 15% of your gross revenue, 15% of gross revenue. For most people, that one move will wipe out completely their profit because their profit margin isn’t 15%.

Speaker 2 (00:27):

If you’re a real estate investor who’s sick and tired of living deal to deal, then welcome home. Hear from everyday real estate investors just like you, and discover how they’ve completely transformed their business by taking a profit First approach. This is the profit first for REI podcast, where we believe revenue is vanity. Profit is sanity. It’s time to start making profit a habit in your business. So here’s your host, David Richter.

Speaker 3 (00:55):

We have Shauna the tax Goddess. This is a great episode. If you need practical bottom line advice of keeping more money in your pocket and not paying too much in taxes, she has a wealth of knowledge. She’s one of, oh man, I think she said one of 15 people in the country that has a certain tax strategy certification where she has, she knows if you are at six figures, seven figures, eight figures, she works with nine figure companies too. She’s been doing this for 25 years. She knows what she’s talking about. I know that if you take away anything from this episode, you will be able to save money on taxes, keyboard money in your pocket and ultimately get to where you want to be. So this is a great episode if you’re looking for more ways to increase your profitability. Shauna, the tax goddess. I am super excited about this interview. Well, first I have to ask, where did you get that name, Shauna?

Speaker 1 (01:45):

Oh, so it actually happened completely at random. Okay. So I was in, this was way at the beginning of my business, like year three, I was standing in a networking group and I was not paying attention. I am a little bit of a chit-chat. So I was talking to somebody else and they put a microphone in front of my face and I stood up and I said, hi, I’m Shauna, the tax goddess. And 300 heads spun looked right at me and a very good friend of mine who is a marketing genius was sitting way on the far side of the room, came up after me after the meeting and said everything. Name the company, name the business name, all the things. And so we’ve been tax goddess ever since.

Speaker 3 (02:22):

Oh, cool. So that was just like a stroke of lightning hit you and you’re like, okay, I’m just going to say this. And it was like, boom. It was a stroke of genius. Lightning hit you, whatever it might be. So the Tax Goddess, and you’ve had that name for how many years

Speaker 1 (02:34):

Now? Geez, 17. A

Speaker 3 (02:38):

Really long

Speaker 1 (02:38):

Time. 17. Wow. There you go. We actually have to defend our name. We have it trademarked and we have to defend our name, get lots of other people that want to use that name.

Speaker 3 (02:46):

Okay, well very cool. So I like that you own it too. That’s definitely a topic for another day and lots of things that people do not do in their business. So that’s where I want to just get into your story. What interested me too that you’re a profit first fan. So I really love that. And that you said you’ve been using it for 20 years. So how did you even get to know about this or 20 years ago? Was it just that you had bank accounts or I’d love to go into that and then we can go into the tax saving strategies that you have for everyone.

Speaker 1 (03:16):

Love it. Yeah, let’s talk about it. So I am a CPA, I’m an accountant, right? I’m absolutely a numbers nerd. I actually started off my life in astrophysics, so I’m all about the numbers, all about math. Wow.

Speaker 3 (03:29):

Yeah, no kidding.

Speaker 1 (03:30):

Love it, love it, love it. And so really when I first started my business, it really wasn’t at the time, it was a called profit first in my head. I went to my family, my advisors, my board of CEOs in the family, and I said, okay, listen, I’m starting a business. I want to make sure I don’t get in trouble. As a cpa, we like to follow rules. So what do I need to do to make sure that my business is running well, that it’s smooth. And one of the first pieces of advice I got was every dollar that comes in the door, you put away 10% for you and 20% for taxes. So 30% of all your money out of sight, out of mind, get it in a different bank, different bank accounts, put it somewhere else. And so I followed that from day one and it has saved me multiple times.


The economic crash in 2008, I’m like, oh, where am I going to get the money from? I had a pile of cash, did really well one year, massive taxes. I had a pile of cash. And so there’s something really comforting and very just so freeing about knowing you have a pile of cash. You right, it’s not locked up in some stock that you can’t sell without a gain. I mean you have a pile of cash and of course how you invest it, totally different matter. But yeah, I’m all about cash is king and cash flow, of course being the emperor. So all the depends.

Speaker 3 (04:52):

I like that. So let me ask this. I thought it was really interesting. You had a board of CEOs. Is your family entrepreneurial or were you the first one to go out there and you found these board of advisor type people or how did that work?

Speaker 1 (05:04):

Kind of a mix half and half. So yeah, definitely we have entrepreneurial in the blood, right? My mom’s an entrepreneur, my dad was an entrepreneur, so there’s definitely an entrepreneur in the blood, but I was very lucky. I’m not even sure what else to say. The people around me, whether it was my family or even just my friends, everybody kind of had this hustle way back before hustle. Culture was a thing. We had hustle. How are we going to make money? Always really big on real estate investing, even back then. So how do you make money to buy your first property, to have a rental property, to get passive income? All of these things were just kind of in the world that I grew up in. And so it was in a way almost expected. You start a business, you get real estate, that’s how you grow wealth go, right? So yeah, definitely from that end and then you just start attracting other people that have the same worldview as you do. So you start to learn all these awesome things as you’re going along through life. So

Speaker 3 (06:01):

Awesome. No, that’s really cool. I like how you said that you’re attract and the like-minded people. I think that’s what we’re all trying to find is that core group and that community and it’s so important. It sounds like that community and network has been very important to you over these years. Very,

Speaker 1 (06:16):

Very. You never

Speaker 3 (06:17):

Know from the cash to whatever run into,

Speaker 1 (06:19):

Yeah, you never know what problem you’re going to run into. And so if you can call, I call them the board of directors, certainly it was never a board of directors when I first started, but you call your peeps and you say, Hey, I got this issue. What did you do? How did you handle it? Did that work out well or not? Which way did this go for you? Yeah,

Speaker 3 (06:37):

That’s great. Sounds like you’ve got another board of advisor there. I dunno, is your dog on the board of advisors with you as well too?

Speaker 1 (06:43):

Yes. I have five. Five dogs, five

Speaker 3 (06:47):

Board of advisors right there.

Speaker 1 (06:48):

Five very loud board of directors, two German Shepherds, a great Dane Concorso and two boxer mixes. And side note, they’re all security write-offs for my business. So best way to get rid of some expenses there.

Speaker 3 (07:02):

That’s great. So is that one of your suggestions is get the types of dogs that are security dogs and then you can write them off or I would love to go into the tax side there. The details. The details, yeah,

Speaker 1 (07:14):

Absolutely. Well, so let’s back up. So every deduction, doesn’t matter what deduction it is, every single deduction gets approved by the IRS if it meets three qualifications. So ordinary, necessary and reasonable. Okay, now I’m going to use. And so it’s specific on your case, on your business, on what you do. Okay, so I’m a CPA, right? I’ve got tons of client information, I’ve got servers that have secure information. So security is a big deal we want to make sure we’re protecting. So security numbers, birthdays, all that information. I also will have people come to my home, my entire firm of a hundred something people is digital across the globe. So people will come to my home if they live local, if they’re flying in to come see me, whatever it is, which means I have two points of security type things. I have personal security for me. What if I don’t know this vendor and I’ve got client security. So security is a big deal, okay?

Speaker 3 (08:14):

Especially in this

Speaker 1 (08:14):

World. When you walk up to my home and you see 120 pound big, black, great Dane concorso, two German shepherds and two boxer mixes looking at you through the front window, right? So I don’t even need to explain, okay, secure now. So we have ordinary, is it ordinary in the course of business for CPA to secure stuff? Yes. Right. I have an alarm system and all these things. Is it necessary? Yeah, protecting my client’s information is pretty necessary. I’m pretty sure the IRS actually has written documentation about security methods for client information so necessary. Absolutely. Is it reasonable? Okay. Five dogs. Maybe we could have gotten away with three big dogs. I dunno.


So maybe I’m missing on the reasonable side. But yeah, so really those are the three categories, and it really doesn’t matter what industry you’re in. The famous case, and I don’t know if I can be, can I be a little risque? I’ll try to keep it professional with a little. Okay, so the most famous IRS case that is specific about ordinary, necessary and reasonable is actually related to a professional dancer, a female professional dancer. And so if we all know what I’m talking about here, she went to a doctor and got some enhancements and she wrote off the enhancements as a business deduction because for her ordinary, necessary and reasonable for her to make more money, IRS didn’t like it. They took her to court.

Speaker 3 (09:47):


Speaker 1 (09:48):

IRS said, no, absolutely not. That’s a personal thing. Has nothing to do with it. The judge, and it’s my, this is why it’s my favorite course case. Judge literally in writing, it’s in the transcript, looked at the IRS agent said, so you’re telling me that she made you more money, paid more taxes, but it’s not a deduction for her business. And the IRS backed off because of course, ordinary, necessary,

Speaker 3 (10:10):

Reasonable should

Speaker 1 (10:11):

Pay more tax on it. So why are you upset? What’s the problem? So it really, really, really does come down to ordinary, necessary, reasonable, and this is where so many people start. It’s basically missed deductions. Nobody ever explained it to them this way. So things like, obviously for you, you have a microphone, ordinary, necessary and reasonable. You have to have it to do what you’re doing, right? Right. Exactly. But what about the decor in the background, right? Do you have to have this sign? Do you have to have what if you have your company logo, right? That would be ordinary, necessary, reasonable advertising. Hi. So a lot of what you do as a business owner, as an investor, this works for investors, it works for real estate professionals. A lot of what you do, you kind of need to run through this filter of ordinary, necessary and reasonable to determine if for you and for what you are doing, you believe that you meet those three categories.

Speaker 3 (11:05):

Yeah, that’s really easy. I like bottom of the shelf type stuff that anyone can go and implement. That’s really good. Is it ordinary, necessary and reasonable? And honestly, your story there, that’s like if they haven’t made a movie on that, that seems like something that’s movie material for going out there and especially to make a tax case. Interesting. That would definitely be an interesting one to cut. And especially what the judge said. I mean, you could just see a cousin Vinny out there, out there with the judge and talking to him. That’s great. That’s just what I picture. Okay. So that’s great. That’s a great framework for knowing if there’s something that you can write off and running that filter through your head. Now, when you reached out and we got together, I liked a lot of the bullet points that you have great bullet points of what you teach on. Out of all those things, what do you think is the most actionable there? Is it the 10 strategies to save 10,000 on their taxes? Or I like this one, how a hundred million dollars companies unlock 6% annual tax rate and what other entrepreneurs can learn from them. I’m like, there’s so much good stuff there. I’m like so much. What do you want to focus on? Because I feel like you could give a ton of value with a lot of these different bullet points. I

Speaker 1 (12:20):

Love it. Well, and so let me see if I can weave those two together. We’ll see what we can get here. Even

Speaker 3 (12:25):


Speaker 1 (12:26):

Even better in the world of tax strategy. Okay, let me back up. There are 660,000 CPAs in the entire US according to Google, okay? Wow. Every CPA does a different thing. You could have them be a CFO, they could be an auditor, they could be a tax person. So just because you know, A CPA doesn’t mean they know tax. When you start to go up the chain of specialty into tax, you get CPA, you get master’s in tax. There’s only 60,000 that have specific masters in tax. Then you start getting into the tax strategy. So certified tax coach, certified tax professionals, certified tax strategists. When you get up to the CTS certified tax strategist, there’s only 15 1 5 15 people in the entire US that run tax strategy at that level. So really what you’re looking at when you look at tax strategy, the 6.92%, we call it the 6% life. It’s the book that I wrote last year goes through all the strategies, Ryan, the

Speaker 3 (13:29):

Way and can’t people get that on Amazon?

Speaker 1 (13:31):

Amazon, yep. A hundred percent. 6% life. We actually beat out Think and Grow Rich for bestseller, which was pretty cool.

Speaker 3 (13:38):


Speaker 1 (13:39):

That was very pay taxes. So pretty cool. But yeah, the way that you get to 6% is you have to layer strategy on strategy on strategy on strategy. So if we stick with writing off my dogs, five dogs probably cost around $20,000 a year. Food training toys, not destroying my furniture, that kind of thing. So $20,000, if your tax rate is let’s say 30 or 40%, you’re saving $6,000 in tax. Well that’s great, but maybe it took me from a 45 to a 44% tax. So how do we chunk that away? And so when you look at tax strategy, there are some tax strategies that are small and they’re easy to do. So paying your kids, having an accountable plan to write up your home office, doing the master’s exemption, the 14 days of free rental on your primary home, these are what we consider to be low hanging fruit.


These are the baby basics that even a brand new strategist, somebody that’s been doing it for a year or two should be able to bring up to you. Okay? When you start needing to write off $2 million worth of revenue, 5 million worth of taxable income, you need some bigger strategies, right? You’re writing out the dogs and the kids only get you to about a hundred thousand. The baby basic strategies should get you to about a hundred thousand. So we start then looking at layering these much bigger strategies. So great example is the 8 31 B, captive insurance. Ryan, you can put away tying us back to profit first. You can put away 15% of your gross revenue, 15% of gross revenue. For most people, that one move will wipe out completely their profit because their profit margin isn’t 15%. So if we can get you to zero, your tax rate’s now zero.


So it really depends. A lot of tax strategy. The answer in the tax world is it depends who are you? What are your circumstances? Are you married? Are you a real estate investor? Do you follow fire? Do you follow profit first? Right? Do you have the cash reserves to put away 15% of your gross revenue into your own private bank with an 8 31 B, right? So yeah, really to get to that 6%, it’s all about understanding the details, the values, the goals, different people are going for different things. Even if we just look at the profit first is I want to have the money to spend the way I want to spend it. The fire people, financial, independent, retire early. They put away 50 to 70% of their money so that they can retire at 35. Two hugely different goals. And so which strategy is going to be best is dependent on what you as a taxpayer want for you, your family, your life. Yeah,

Speaker 3 (16:32):

That’s really good. So then there’s some that are basic when you go over the 10 strategies. So it’s like those first three, the basic ones, and do they get more advanced as you get up to the latter free

Speaker 1 (16:42):

Teach, I include, yeah, I try to include, listen, there’s over 1500 strategies that we look at on every single case. If you’re coming to us, we look at all the things, but if I wrote 1500 strategies in a book, it’d be the new Bible, right? I mean, right? Yes, it would. So tax bible with the tax goddess, I don’t know. Anyway, right, there

Speaker 3 (17:02):

You go. That’s an option.

Speaker 1 (17:05):

So in the book, I’ve tried to include some baby basics, some medium ones. I’ve included one or two of the really big ones. And I think in the book, in my personal opinion, one of the most important things you can take out of the book, of course strategies are great, helpful. We give you the pitfalls, what you need to be looking at, how to do it, how not to get into trouble. But one of the most important things that you need to know as an individual is what is your aggression scale? Okay? So if you think about zero to 10, zero meaning the IRS never calls you, never ever and 10 mean we’re all going to jail.


Where do you want to be on that scale? Okay. Because everybody’s different. Okay, now, if A is going to jail, a nine is doing Al Capone, we’re doing some shady stuff and we’re hoping we’re not getting caught. Okay? And an eight is legal, a hundred percent court case backup, all the documentation. An eight is legal, but you might get a call, right? The IRS might say, Hey, can you show us the documentation on X, Y, Z? So your aggression scale is going to determine which strategies you use or don’t use, right? Like an 8 31 B as an example. The really big one, there’s a level 4, 8 31 B, that doesn’t save as much. It’s still good. It’s still 5% of gross revenue, which is still really big. And there’s a level 8, 8 31 B, which is 15%. So where you are, where does your spouse sit? A lot of people out there right now are listening going, oh yeah, I’m an eight. I don’t care if call if I have all the legal backup. Yeah, your spouse might be a two, might have to go to a six. So yeah, does that help?

Speaker 3 (18:46):

That helps for being able to know the person’s situation and where they are, and then the aggression scale of how aggressive you want to be. And then it sounds like you never suggest going past that eight because eight is where the legal

Speaker 1 (19:01):

Stops. Yeah, I’m a CPA and I’m a redhead, and red and orange do not look good together, right? We’re not doing it. So we have had clients call us and say, listen, I don’t care. I’m moving to Belize. They can come get me. I’m going to go, what was the McAfee guy living in the sand dunes? Listen, if that’s the life you want, okay, we know that stuff. I know all the things. I have seen everything under the sun. I’ve been doing this for almost 25 years now. So I’ve seen a lot of things. But yeah, you have to decide. And I’m not signing that tax return Uhuh, right? Because I still like my life in freedom in the us, right? Yeah,

Speaker 3 (19:40):

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, that makes sense. So then we’ve talked about a lot of the general tax stuff. What about for real estate investors? So is there any specific tips for that community?

Speaker 1 (19:51):

Yeah, well, so one of the biggest ones, now I don’t want to recover basics, right? I mean, I’ve listened to lots of your episodes and so I don’t want to cover basics. You guys already know about the passive versus active versus real estate professional. And if you want me to go into detail, let me know. You’ve already got, I’m sure, the short-term rental. So the Airbnb strategy, the VBO strategy, how can you use that to offset W2 income? Fantastic strategy. We often talk about getting married or divorced, legally married or divorced, not actually in real life kind of thing. But if you’ve got a friend who’s a real estate professional and you want to get married to get the best tax benefit of them being a real estate professional and you having a really high W2 or wherever your income’s coming from, great do that.


So use marriage and divorce as a strategy strategy. One of the ones that we see missed the most is actually if you buy a building that your business is going to be in. So if you ever run into that combination, there’s a really cool little known strategy. It’s called the aggregation rule. And it effectively says that even if you’re not a real estate professional, if you have the business and you put it in a building that you own, you can actually aggregate those two and you can take cost segregation and it will offset all the profits of your business, which is very little known. And so most people don’t do it. And so we see often from the real estate investment side, yeah, I’ve got my primary business, great, can you move the headquarters every two years? Can you do something to continually every other year, get this deduction and write off with cost?


Of course, write off huge amounts of money in the first five years, right? Yeah. So those are kind of the big things. And I think on the other end when people, because now you’ve taken ec, you have this huge depreciation, how do you not pay tax when you sell? It would be the other end of it. Things like installment trusts, crat, clat, crut, CRTs. There’s about eight different kinds of trusts that you can use to sell something and not pay tax. So if you’re going to do the 10 31, great. Do that. Okay. But then your basis is this big, you can’t cost seg. Again, if you want to get out of it by a new building, there’s the trust end of all of this, which allows you to sell, pay zero, tax, zero even on the depreciation, recapture in the year of sale. So some awesome strategies on that end,

Speaker 3 (22:34):

Which a lot of people just don’t know. They hear the more general stuff out there, but I feel like then a lot of people aren’t getting the, like you said, if there’s only 15 cts is out there, the strategist, then yeah, there’s not a big pool of, especially even for content, the content people are popping up all the time, but not for that type of stuff.

Speaker 1 (22:55):

And it’s one of the things that, I mean, listen, let me back up. I love the content folks. I really do, right? The tiktoks are giving you a 32nd because what are they doing? They’re triggering you on, oh, I should go learn about that. I am all about the education. I love the education, but big star caveat, blinking lights, please do not try to do it on your own without the proper items. Because the 32nd TikTok that tells you to put your kids on payroll, even the baby basics tells you to put your kids on payroll, does not tell you if you don’t file this form, you’re in trouble. If you don’t pay them this way, you’re in trouble. If you don’t have a proper job description with proper duties, you’re in trouble. You just can’t get 25 years of knowledge into a 32nd TikTok. You just can’t,

Speaker 3 (23:43):

Especially for a topic this big too, and that’s constantly changing and updating and that you need someone that’s the strategist there that is constantly going to be updating themselves too along that journey versus the flash in the pan.

Speaker 1 (23:57):

Exactly. I mean, many people don’t realize every morning I get three emails, one from the IRS, one from a conglomeration service about all of the states, and one specifically about the IRS going after bad people. You don’t want your name in that email, right? Yeah,

Speaker 3 (24:15):

Kidding. That’s a wrong in,

Speaker 1 (24:17):

Right? And so every morning I read through on average, let’s say 30 court cases in this state, this happened at the federal level, this happened, this happened to this change. Ryan, most CPAs, even most people that call themselves, and there’s lots of tax strategists out there, my CTS, my ct C, my CTPs, right? There’s lots of this out there. 607 total. How do you have enough time? I mean, I am lucky in the fact I’m blessed in the fact that I was able to build a business of 100 plus staff. I got peep. So my brain can focus on what’s the court case, what’s going on, what’s the change? Oh, we need to change this strategy in this way to make sure we are not on the IRS bad list. So you really got to be looking at who’s talking, how much research are they doing, and what kind of team do they have behind them? Those kinds of things.

Speaker 3 (25:07):

Yeah. And do you run your company all virtually

Speaker 1 (25:09):

At this point? We do. Yeah. We went all digital 13 years ago actually. So yeah, we’ve got teams, like I said, a little over a hundred people in 17 different countries at this point. So we’re allowed to pick from the best of the best around the globe, which is great.

Speaker 3 (25:24):

Yeah, that is very cool. So then building that company, I’m sure there was lots of bumps and bruises along the road. Do you have any lessons, maybe the biggest lessons you’ve learned in your business growth and the entrepreneurship and all the different things that you’ve gone personally, not just the tax side?

Speaker 1 (25:45):

I love it. I love it. Alright, so the biggest one in growing a company, we follow a performance versus culture, and I’m literally going to call it a church. Every three months, everyone in the company, including myself, gets ranked by other people on their team or whoever’s doing the ranking, get ranked on a performance level, but also on a culture fit level. Now as a person, and you said it could be a little bit risque, I don’t like dealing with assholes. Most people I don’t. So if you fall, performance is performance, are you good at what you do? Do you have the technical knowledge? Do you get it? Can you do it? And do you want it? Those three, right? The culture standpoint is very much about tax Goddess. As a company, we have a very open culture. I expect people to ask for help.


Don’t spin your wheels, no emotional blackmail, no gossip, that kind of thing. I will not tolerate that anywhere near me or anywhere near my company. So if somebody falls on that culture scale, but they’re really high performer, they get booted. We don’t keep those kinds of staff, we don’t keep those kinds of clients. We don’t work with vendors like that. So I’m very much kind of a chill. I like chill, happy. So yeah, I think that would be the biggest deciding in your own mind and agreeing what you as the owner of the business will and will not tolerate. That would be my biggest lesson where people get into trouble. This person’s a great performer, but I can’t replace the body. I need somebody to do the work. And so they put up with toxic behavior and it’s never worth it. It’s never worth it.

Speaker 3 (27:27):

Well, there you go. That’s good stuff. It sounds like you have a process and system in place to make sure your core values are carried out throughout the organization and on a regular basis too. It’s not just a one time, oh yeah, this was a good thing that we did. Then dust it off three years later and say, yeah, we should do that again. So it sounds like this is a quarterly occurrence. Absolutely. This was really good stuff. So lots of information here. I love that you gave the overview at the beginning, the qualifications, ordinary, necessary, reasonable, the aggression scale. I thought that was great too. Do you really need to know what kind of advice you want to seek based on who you are as a person and the dynamic, especially between if you’ve got someone that’s a significant other in your life, lots of good stuff here.


You need to go back and listen to it again to get some of those sound bites and information there. This is a great episode. You’ve got your book, the 6% Life, which is on Amazon, and she’s showing it on camera too, the 6% Life. So go and look that up as well if you want more info on that. And then Shauna, how do people get ahold of you? If people want to say like, okay, this sounds like something I need in my life for Shauna and her company and what they’re doing, so how do they reach out?

Speaker 1 (28:40):

So super easy to find Tax goddess.com, super, super duper easy. From that end, that’s easy, and especially because we’re talking about Profit First. If anybody is looking for an app specifically to run Profit First automatically in the background, cash goblin.com, that app is currently in beta and it should be going live here pretty soon, so check this

Speaker 3 (29:02):

Out. Very cool. Yeah, so that’s where you can find her tax goddess.com, and then the cash goblin, that’s cash goblin.com. Cash goblin.com. Yep. For that. I love that name. That’s great. Cash, Compli one. Oh man, good stuff. But this has been really awesome. We’ll probably have to have you on again because there’s just a wealth of information and knowledge and it’s like this is really good stuff, and especially for the real estate investing community, just want to make sure that they’re keeping more in their pocket. This is a great episode to try and keep more in your pocket based on where you are on your journey, and then really taking a dive into that. And I love those qualifications. Ordinary, necessary, reasonable, make sure it fits those three criteria, or it’s on the fence. At least three dogs versus five dogs, that type of thing too.


So, so you know, you heard it from the CPA’s mouth. This is good stuff. Shauna, thank you for being on today. You’re a great guest and I want to just tell you, if you’re listening to this, thank you for listening. If you need help on the cash side, you need Profit First implemented in your business, like what the heck are you guys talking about? I just found you randomly and it sounded interesting. Then reach out to us@simplecfo.com. We’re there to help you implement Simple, the Profit First System, give you that forward facing information and make sure that you’re working with people like Shauna too, that actually know what is going on on the tax side and can help you get to where you want to be and keep more money so you can reach out to us as well. Shauna, thank you again for being on and providing a lot of value to our listeners.

Speaker 1 (30:27):

Thank you so much for having me. This was nothing but fun.

Speaker 3 (30:30):

Awesome. Thanks, Shauna.

Speaker 2 (30:32):

This episode of The Profit First for REI podcast is over, but there are plenty more where that came from. Are you ready to learn how David and his team can help implement the Profit First system in your business? Schedule a discovery call@simplecfo.com right now. We’ll see you next time on The Profit First for REI podcast with David Richter.

Title: “Realize Your REI Potential with Jennifer Steward: Authenticity, Profitability, and Consistency”

Episode: 240

In this episode of Profit First for REI podcast, we are sitting down with Jennifer Steward of REI Data Source, to unveil the secret weapon you’ve been missing: authenticity. 

Jen will crack the code on how to project a winning image that seals the deal…But wait, there’s more! Learn the top revenue activities every entrepreneur should master and discover the power of consistent strategies to solve your REI problems.

This episode is your blueprint to a thriving virtual business. Don’t miss out!

Key Takeaways:

[0:50] Introducing Jennifer Steward

[6:07] Project an image of success from

time to time

[9:16] Some best revenue activities that every entrepreneur should know

[11:00] Leveraging every avenue that you can, get consistency, and make sure you’re solving current problems

[17:43] The golden ratio in social media marketing is: 90% business and 10% personal

[25:02] The benefits of running a virtual business


[4:20] “Authenticity is like a business repellant.”

[10:09]  “In a market where you can’t dind deals but there’s plenty of money, you have to be the person who knows how to find the deals.” 

Connect with Jennifer:

REI Data Source Website: https://www.reidatasource.net 

Jen’s Email: jen@reidatasource.net 

Phone Number: (469) 952-8011

Tired of living deal to deal? 

If you are a real estate investor or business owner who is tired of living deal to deal and want to double your profits, head over here to book your no-obligation discovery call with me. Either myself or someone from my team will hop on a short call with you to get clear on your business goals, remove any obstacles holding you back, and map out a game plan to help you finally start keeping more of the money you work so hard to make. – David


Speaker 1 (00:00):

You need to just be able to solve the seller’s problem and just start with one exit strategy that you’re really confident in. And then once you master that, expand from there. And like you and I talked about, it’s who not how you don’t have time. Most likely to master all of those. So have a referral partner that you can build a relationship with and trust.

Speaker 2 (00:23):

If you’re a real estate investor who’s sick and tired of living deal to deal, then welcome home. Hear from everyday real estate investors just like you, and discover how they’ve completely transformed their business by taking a profit First approach. This is the profit first for REI podcast, where we believe revenue is vanity. Profit is sanity. It’s time to start making profit a habit in your business. So here’s your host, David Richter.

Speaker 3 (00:50):

Today we have Jennifer Stewart on which she is a go-getter. She’s out there, she’s doing lots of things. She’s in the cold calling space. She’s also a real estate investor. But then she’s also someone who I think has gone through a lot in her life and has come out on the other side stronger. And you can tell just from what she talks about and what she sees as the most successful real estate investors, what they do on a daily basis, on a monthly basis, it’s just good bottom line stuff to help you if you want to become someone who’s consistent in business, no matter what the market is doing. So I think this is going to be a really good episode. She gets into the nitty gritty and also just helping you get to where you want to be and making more money as a entrepreneur. Jennifer, welcome to the Profit First REI podcast. I’m so excited you’re here today.

Speaker 1 (01:37):

David, thank you so much for having me. I’ve been looking forward to this all weekend. What a great way to spend a Tuesday at noon and thank you. Thank you so much for having me today.

Speaker 3 (01:47):

Yeah, well I’m excited because we dance around in these different groups and we’re going to these events and you’re speaking a lot, you’re helping a lot of people out there, and I see you as someone who’s just very much, I hope this comes across, but just a very mature human being that has gone through a lot, but you haven’t just been a victim. You’ve been someone who said, I’m going to grow from what I’ve gone through, and that’s what I’ve just observed. And then honestly, there’s lots of my friends that respect you a lot too. I’ve gotten to know you well, so I’m excited about this one. So many things that I feel like we could go down, lots of roads here. So again, thank you for being on the show.

Speaker 1 (02:25):

I appreciate that. That’s very generous and kind observation. I think mature is a very polite word and I am just kind of overwhelmed with that kind assessment.

Speaker 3 (02:37):

Yeah, well, I don’t want to use any rude words for you here today, so we’re going to dive into it. No, but seriously I do. I see as someone who takes a lot of those lessons and applies them right away. I would also say too that you are not scared about sharing what you’ve learned and what you’ve gone through. Where do you get that deep sense of truth to share exactly what’s going on? And I don’t know if you’re a fan of the office or if you’ve ever seen that show. I like the Office, if you like the office. Where is it? I think it’s Kelly’s, Dayton, Daryl, and she says, he said, who says exactly what they’re thinking? What kind of game is that? And I’m like, that is Jennifer to a t. And I’m just wondering how did you get that as part of you? Because I think it’s so genuine, authentic, and it brings more people to you and they resonate. You’re saying what they’re scared to say.

Speaker 1 (03:30):

My business advisors have told me to do the opposite. They said

Speaker 3 (03:36):

Genuine, sorry. That’s great. Basically the

Speaker 1 (03:38):

More money you’re going to make, you have to play the game. And so what I’ll do, David being totally transparent, is I’ll turn that on and off depending on my revenue. So I know that sounds hilarious probably, but if my revenue gets lower, I will turn off the authenticity to a certain extent and go back into my polite game, the system mode. But whenever income is plentiful, I’ll go back to being more my authentic sharing self because number one, sometimes I get more business than I can possibly ever take down, and that’s overwhelming. And so I find that authenticity is like a business repellent, but it’s so much, it’s so stressful for me to be fake. It’s so stressful for me to be something I’m not. And that’s me being a little bit funny, but also kind of realistic as a business woman. And then there’s me as a person who has a soul and that person wants to connect. That person realizes that I’m not just here to make money, I am here to help people who are suffering. And I know that sounds cheesy and cliche, but it’s true. And lemme tell you, I don’t want to be one of those people who are suffering. So I will switch into a mode that is more polished, if that makes sense.

Speaker 3 (05:09):

That makes sense.

Speaker 1 (05:10):

Because I don’t want to starve. And so I do kind of go back and forth between, okay, I need to dial it back. And I think that people notice that if I was just all the time talking about what a person can overcome or the deep parts of our why and our feelings, then I think that would really drive away a lot of business. I’ve seen people who got up on stage and talked about aligning the chakras and they were never invited back. So you have to find a balance between being a compelling human who helps people overcome these internal struggles that we likely all face, especially as entrepreneurs, depression, anxiety, slow times debt overhead, really painful things that will keep up at night and destroy your health and destroy your relationships. And then we also need to focus on, unfortunately we have to project an image of success from time to time because I’ll tell you, I always get the most business whenever I’m on vacation, I can actively ask people to leave me alone while I’m on vacation.


And that’s whenever I get all the messages for, Hey, I want to do business with you. Because they see the success, they see that it works. When really that’s I’m spending the money, that’s whenever I’m the least successful because I’m not putting time into my business and the dollars are just flying out the window like someone who has an open wound. And so it’s funny because it’s whenever you’re doing the best that it doesn’t show, and whenever I’m making the most money, it’s usually whenever I look the worst, I haven’t had time to groom myself. I’m probably still wearing pajamas that day. And so it’s almost always the opposite as to who has money and who doesn’t. So the person you see with the super nice house and the super nice car, those people have confided in me, Hey, I have so much pressure, I feel like I’m going to lose it.


But those are the people that look up to and respect. And so that being said, David, if I was financially independent, 100% I would be genuine and deep and all the time, if that makes sense. It would be like, Hey, when you woke up today, did you thank God for just waking up? And what are some ways that you can lower your overhead? What are some ways you can increase revenue? Are you wasting time on non-revenue generating activities? Are you doing too much stuff for free? Those of us who are in real estate, I think we do too many things for free. And like you and I talked about, it’s not just your expenditures that are on your books, it’s also the expenditures that are on your time. And so I talked to my attorney last week about dropping non-revenue generating businesses that just aren’t converting because there’s hope in one hand and there’s numbers in the other.


And after a certain amount of time, you need to realize which businesses are covering for the businesses that are taking a loss. And so my lawyer kind of sat me down and I know you do this, and we had to look at which businesses are just not generating and which are carrying the ones that aren’t. And he said, just focus on the ones that are. And so that being said, whenever we wake up every day, if we are our real selves all day, it usually doesn’t translate into revenue. But when I have the luxury of being myself, David, I always want to reduce the suffering of others because that’s kind of all I’ve done my whole life is I’ve had to overcome and overcome and overcome and overcome to a degree that just feels, it could feel really unlucky if I let myself go there. But instead of feeling unlucky, I have to see the opposite side of it. So for all the extremely low probability things that happened to me, there’s also extreme low probability things that happened for me. And you have to see both.

Speaker 3 (09:11):

Right. That’s really good. That is really good. So since we’ve gone down this road, and especially for the real estate investors listening, what would you say are some of the best revenue producing activities they could be doing or that you see in your own life that you do that translates into that

Speaker 1 (09:29):

You have to fill a niche that nobody else is filling? You have to see a problem that everyone is facing a hitch in the giddy up that’s keeping everyone from making money. What I’m noticing right now, for example, people don’t have the money for down payments on their loans. So like we mentioned before the call, I’m offering a program where you can do a hundred percent financing as long as you’re one of my cold calling clients. And it blew up because people don’t have the money for a down payment right now, and my cold callers really aren’t that expensive. And so it solves that problem for them. And in the past, the biggest problem was finding deals. And in a market where you can’t find deals, but there’s plenty of money, then you have to be the person who knows how to find the deals.


And so you have to find what’s keeping people from making money today in the current market and then really, really leverage your social media and go speak, like you and I talked about before, go speak on those topics, mention it on social media, put it in your stories, tell people what you do, and then be really consistent with your message because people are watching, they want to see consistency. And it’s like my lawyer taught me, who’s Jeff Watson? If they see you being erratic and all over the place and not consistent in your message, then people don’t trust that they can go to you to solve these problems. And so that’s the big key is leveraging your social media and being really consistent in your message and making sure that you’re solving the problems of today. So those three things, consistency, solving the current problems and just making sure that you’re leveraging pretty much every avenue that you can.


And of course, always want to be competent and run an ethical business because you can spend 10 years building a reputation. And if you hire one bad employee or someone who makes you look bad or doesn’t deliver for a client, unfortunately bad news spreads like wildfire and just whatever you’re buying on Amazon, you’re going to pay more attention to the bad review than the good reviews because we’re looking for to avoid pain for good reasons. I mean, some things could take us out and set us back a decade if we make the wrong investment. And so it’s really, really important in a capital intensive business what we’re in to be someone who’s trustworthy, competent with very high integrity. Like you and I talked last week and I told you, I was like, Hey, I can’t be consulting on a topic that I don’t know about. Thank you for the inquiry. But that would be horribly unethical. And you have to do that. You have to turn down the fast money for the long-term play of having high integrity.

Speaker 3 (12:18):

Yeah, no, a hundred percent. That’s really good. I think that’s consistency, solving the problem for today and then getting the message out. So those are three steps there. And I think that’s where it’s like, it’s so simple, but it’s like that number one, you got to do it consistently and you got to move to where the market is. So I think that’s really good stuff because I can’t agree more because I think, do you think that a lot of real estate investors build themselves into a box and then when that solving the problem of what they used to do doesn’t solve it anymore, that they have a hard time pivoting to something that will and bring the revenue? Yeah,

Speaker 1 (12:57):

I mean you have your fast movers, your highly networked people who are poised to move, but for anyone who doesn’t want to hustle 24 7, it’s hard to pivot like that. I mean, at some point, I think human beings, we all want consistency, predictability. And one thing that’s really tough about this business, and I’m sure everyone notices, is how fast paced it really is. Now, if we were in the paper business, for example, David, how much do you think things change? Speaking of office space or not office space, the

Speaker 3 (13:35):

Office office,

Speaker 1 (13:36):

Yeah, yeah. I mean if we’re a paper company, how often do you think the industry changes? Right.

Speaker 3 (13:42):

It doesn’t really change. I don’t know.

Speaker 1 (13:44):

I mean maybe a paper guy comes and messages us and said, oh, you wouldn’t believe.


But it seems like from the outside looking in that real estate, every day there’s some new gimmicky stuff and you’re just like, I can’t handle this. I need to step away because I can’t handle one more gimmick. I can’t handle one more big change. It’s difficult. And so I think knowing the fundamentals, because I know people who make big money just using a yellow pad for their CRMs still, and some of these people are big names, and I don’t think he’d mind me saying, Adam Johnson, Leon Johnson’s son, he does a lot of deals just using a yellow pad. Courtney Frickey, she has her paper leads that she keeps in a file and only goes through them if she needs to. So a lot of these gimmicks just really aren’t the real deal. The real deal is not necessarily what software you’re using, it’s where are we in the market, are there more deals than money or is there more money than deals?


Those are really the main two shifts that if you pay attention to those in the market, you’re good. And people was like, oh, I do this with AI and I do that with ai. I haven’t seen AI do anything really amazing except for Google search type stuff. I mean, I’ve listened to the AI calls and they’re still not that great yet. And I keep hearing people say, oh, AI is going to be doing our acquisition management soon. Well, yes, true, but when I haven’t seen it yet and still, which problem is it solving the low money problem or the low inventory problem? And right now I think it’s market to market. It’s kind of like mushrooms and in certain markets we still have an inventory problem and other markets are more of a buyer’s market and we have more of a money problem. So you have to take it market by market, city by city and see which problem are you solving. Those are really the main two problems in real estate. And what I’ve seen is everything else is a marketing gimmick. As someone who does marketing myself, we try to repackage it to get people’s attention, but it’s kind of all the same stuff.

Speaker 3 (15:59):

Yeah, no, that makes sense. So would you say then the people like Adam and the people like Courtney, are those three things that you mentioned before consistent solve the problem for today and then the media and the messaging is that their key to success and as long as they’re consistent doing, what’s really is that or is there something that makes them different just because they go out there, and I love how you said with their CRM is a yellow legal pad, it’s none of the fancy stuff and all that where a lot of people get trapped in that rabbit hole. So that’s where my I’m wondering, yeah,

Speaker 1 (16:31):

Courtney’s really consistent on Instagram and she gets a lot of referrals. And Adam’s been in his market for 20 years, so he gets a lot of referrals. So you talk about consistency, it’s decades of consistency in Adam’s case, and Courtney has been doing it I think for 10 years, and she really gets out there in terms of, she speaks in front of realtors groups, she speaks at rhe, she holds her radio show, and she’s very consistent in her branding. She doesn’t just show herself boating on the weekend or shopping or whatever. And if you look back through her Instagram, you can see that in the past she did have more of showing her personal life. And Connor Steinbrook taught me, don’t show your personal life, just make your entire page about business. But there is one caveat to that. You don’t want to look like one of those VA generated pages where there’s no real person behind it.

Speaker 3 (17:23):


Speaker 1 (17:24):

Looks like a VA just runs my page and it’s just my VA who does everything. So I do post pictures of my family and going to the gym, and if I do go on vacation, I do post that. But too much of it makes people think you’re not available for business. So I would say the golden ratio that I’ve discovered is about 90% business and 10% personal, just to add that speckle of reality that you are a real person and not a va. And I think Courtney does that very well on her Instagram for example, and she doesn’t even have to spend money on marketing. She told me she doesn’t do that anymore. She’s a hundred percent referral based now and it’s taken being consistent

Speaker 3 (18:04):

And she does a lot of creative deals or that’s all she does is the creative type deals. She

Speaker 1 (18:10):

Does kind of everything. I know her to do flips, I know her to do. She’s mostly a buy and hold investor and she will do creative when she needs to. But I think I’ve had a lot of clients come to me over the years and try to curate a marketing plan where all we do is creative for them. And that is really tough. You’re going to have a low ratio of being able to do that. Typically creative should be something that comes organically from time to time. If you make that your only goal, and this was a guy with a lot of money, by the way, the one I’m thinking of. He had so much money, yet he was super focused on just doing creative. And I understand if someone has no money and they’re just focused on doing creative, but they get it in their head that this is the way to do it and there is no the way to do it.


You have to just solve the problem of the current seller who wants to sell, whether it’s a listing, whether it’s innovation, whether it’s a flip, whether it’s a wholesale, whether it’s long-term buying hold subject to seller finance, and anything else I’m missing in there. It shouldn’t just be, oh, I’m going to pull this list and I’m just going to do ovations or I’m going to do this campaign. I’m just going to do subject two. You need to just be able to solve the seller’s problem and just start with one, this is something I’ve taught for years. Just start with one exit strategy that you’re really competent in. And then once you master that, expand from there, and like you and I talked about, it’s who not how you don’t have time most likely to master all of those. So have a referral partner that you can build a relationship with and trust for innovations for subject to maybe even for seller financing or maybe master two, but mastering all of the above would be insanity. Even if you had been doing this for 50 years like Leon Johnson, that would be insanity. So be ready to leverage joint venture partners that you can trust with the right paperwork behind it. Of course.

Speaker 3 (20:02):

Would you say that if you go down that road, can you build a business like that? Meaning where a business is systems and other people where eventually you have a business that runs itself or runs it with the people in the processes you’ve put in place. It seems like with real estate, like you’re saying, I have to solve the seller’s problem right then and there. So it almost sounds like you need at those higher level people, you can’t just get the McDonald’s line worker that’s there or the robot or AI or something like that. That’s

Speaker 1 (20:33):

The challenge that I’ve run into. And I feel like conceptually it can be done, but then in psychology we have something called channel factors, these little things that get in the way of what sounds good on paper. And that’s usually where the human element comes in because I have staff of 180 people in my agency and I’ve learned little tricks to managing them. For example, this is going to sound weird, I don’t do company meetings because I just meet with them as I need to. I do spend a lot of time with them upfront, maybe a few hours, and then I never talk to them again except to tell them when a job has come in. And if they need more than that, they’re probably not a good fit. And I don’t do group meetings because I’ve had them all group up against me in the past to raise wages, basically wanting to unionize whenever my clients can’t afford that.


And I said, I’ll let the whole company burn down before I let you extort me in this way. And I did. And I did it privately. I didn’t tell anyone. I didn’t go public about it, but I just stopped the company for six months and just traveled. And it’s like I have plenty of money. And then they were suffering. And then once I was done traveling, they were like, Jen, please, please, I’ll come back. So who would think that there’s a human variable of needing to stop people from organizing against you, or it’s like Adam Johnson says, you have to make sure that you’re always in the way of a deal in order to get it done. So that’s why you can’t fully replace yourself for the most part unless you sell the company, is because at some point somewhere you need to add value. And yes, you can have an integrator, and yes, you can have a CEO, and yes, you can have a CFO, et cetera, but if you notice even in a C class corporation, you still have shareholders.


The shareholders are still in the way in some way because they own a part of the company. So no matter what, you have to make sure that you’re in the way of other people just taking over completely what you do and just pushing you out. And so that is the challenge. That’s where replacing, that’s what no one talks about. Everyone wants to sell these sexy business models where you’re just on the beach or whatever, but at some point you have to put yourself between yourself and someone else to make sure you’re still adding value or you’re just going to get pushed out. So another example is, I mean, you can just live like my older gentleman, friends who just own a bunch of mutual funds and they don’t manage anything. They just collect checks from the dividends, but you have to have millions in order to achieve that.


Lemme tell you, those are the people who have the most passive income that I’ve seen, and I know this is an REI podcast, but what’s great about real estate is you can start with a relatively small amount of money and then with appreciation, leverage that into millions, and then you can become the mutual fund, the note owner or your kids can get your portfolio, but it’s not as passive as just having your mutual fund dividends come in and as know the stock market goes up and down where rents typically, there’s not as much fluctuation in rents as there is in the stock market. And so all that being said, going back to what you asked, whenever you’re managing staff, there’s just going to be all these psychological factors that are not going to present themselves on paper with your staff is always the biggest challenge in running a company.


And so that’s why I don’t do company meetings because that’s whenever people get together, and pardon my language, I think it’s a poignant word. They start bitching and then that causes morale issues. All it takes is one person to start griping and then morale goes way down. And I don’t care how well you run your company, I don’t care if you are like you have in the background, I don’t care if you’re Mr. Rogers, as soon as someone starts griping and it takes hold, it’s game over. This doesn’t work if you run a brick and mortar business. But I have doctor friends, for example. They run brick and mortar businesses, and one of my doctor’s friends two weeks ago, his entire staff just walked out. They’ve been with them for 20 years and they couldn’t have organized like that if you keep them separate. If you’re running a virtual business, that’s one of the benefits is you can manage your staff. And I tell you, that has made my income extremely passive.


So if you take nothing else away from this by keeping my staff separated, I have generated true passive income for myself because all I do is bring the jobs, bring the clients, they work the clients, and then they do a good job and then I’m out. The only thing I have to do is keep bringing in new clients because there is always going to be some small amount of attrition no matter how good of a job you do for various reasons. So yeah, if you have a virtual business, keep your staff separate and that way they’re not coming together. And it’s amazing how peaceful things are. I have no drama. I have no complaints. I’ve known go well. so-and-so did this, and so-and-so said this, and so-and-so gets paid this and I want to get paid this. It’s like I have literally zero drama in my agency with my staff now, and that has just been amazing.

Speaker 3 (26:03):

Yeah, that’s the first time I’ve heard it put like that of keeping separate in that you don’t run meetings and you don’t get them together, which is very anti, a lot of the books out there and a lot of those systems and stuff that have the organizational meetings and that type of stuff, level 10 meetings or the level 10 meetings and all that, that goes along with it. So I love hearing a contrarian viewpoint, especially for someone who runs a virtual business like that and who’s gone through almost like you said, the utilization of that type of stuff. Yeah, I’ve been this for

Speaker 1 (26:37):

Six years, and so that’s enough time to where you’ve passed some task, kissed a lot of frogs and had every problem under the sun.

Speaker 3 (26:44):

Yeah, yeah, no kidding. So that’s very interesting. Well, this has been a lot of fun. I love the answers that you’ve given. I think there’s some really good value there too with being consistent, solving today’s problem and getting it out there, being consistent of getting out your message as well too. I also like that what you just went over that was so contrary to what other people say. That was really an interesting take. I want to, and I

Speaker 1 (27:10):

Would bet you my headaches are much smaller than theirs,

Speaker 3 (27:14):

Probably. Probably. I mean, well, most people have the headaches in business, and if you just have less than them that it probably wouldn’t take much if you just had just that many less. So that’s great. I love hearing that. What I wanted to talk

Speaker 1 (27:29):

Authentic draws better clients too. I did want to share that because I know I went on a bit of a rant and a ramble about that, but let me be pointing on one point is that by being my real self, David against my business advisor’s advice, the clients I have now, I have no drama with and I don’t know why I’m not smart enough, I guess to know why. But the ones who come to me whenever I’m going through times of being very authentic and just really sharing whatever it is, whatever business problems or personal problems that I may be facing and how I’m overcoming them, I get so many people, like you said, who may not do business immediately and it scares off a lot of people. But the clients who do come to me, we have no problems, no drama. They don’t blame me for a lack of success.


They just come in, show up, close their deals, and they stay long-term customers. So that is one benefit is I get fewer clients, but the ones that I do get, I have zero drama with, and we’re so simpatico that I work hard to make sure they’re successful and they don’t. Whenever I was being inauthentic and getting a lot more clients, we don’t have meetings about Jennifer, why am I spending this money and not getting any deals and then this, and they’re just being very nitpicky, but clients where I’m my authentic self, they come in and they just close deals, David, we don’t have to have awkward meetings that make me feel like crap about myself, feeling like I’m not really actually helping anyone and I’m just charging money and nothing’s happening for them. They come in and they’re like, Hey, Jen, I did this deal. I did this deal. Your staff is great. And so that was a crazy change to me. I thought, this is self-destructive behavior being this authentic, but I just felt compelled to actually help people. And then these clients are the most low maintenance clients I’ve ever had. So I would be curious what your take is on that in terms of why is it being authentic? First off, it’s interesting. It draws in less clients, but the ones that does draw in, I have zero drama, zero problems with, and they stay with me forever,

Speaker 3 (29:36):

Which is funny because what you’re describing now is in those books that tell you to have the meetings, it’s like it’s your core values. It’s the values that are shining through that. It’s people that resonate with you as a human being. So usually they’re going to be the ones, especially if you’re being authentic and being open and honest and sharing values that are just as a society, we look at and say, it’s mature what you’re doing. You draw those mature people in, so it’s like they’re going to be the ones that sit back, they do the deals, they get it done, and then they come to you and they be like, yeah, let’s keep moving forward. And that’s the low drama because projecting that out there as well too, just from what I can observe right there. But I really like that because very much of if you’re going to be yourself, you might bring in less, but you might bring more of the people that you want to work with. That’s what I took away from makes income

Speaker 1 (30:26):

More passive because that is always my goal. Low drama staff, low drama clients where we’re just doing deals. I’m providing excellent staff who are going to make sure that you’re getting in front of as many people as possible for as little money as possible, talking to those motivated sellers, getting good prices on data, getting good prices on your loans to close your deals, and just keep it simple. There shouldn’t be any insanity. There shouldn’t be a lot of complaints and craziness. And that’s not to say there’s never problems, but when there are, it’s like, Hey, Jen, we need to have a meeting because this caller’s gotten a little too lax and they’re just becoming too rote and they’re going through the motions too much. I had to have that call three months ago, but guess what? He didn’t leave. He didn’t blame. He said, Hey, let’s just fix, let’s just fix their script.


And so I told her, I said, Hey, you’re one of my best, and maybe you’re working too long hours. Maybe you need to take more breaks. Maybe we need to load you up with fewer clients because instead of listening to the seller, you are kind of just pushing through the script. I said, someone who started out cold calling myself, I noticed I would do that towards the end of my shift. And I said, so let’s just be aware that that’s what’s going on. But I didn’t blame or shame her. I just said, Hey, because I was sitting in that seat myself for so many years, David is a cold caller. I know what problems they face, and it makes me a better manager for them. And just say, Hey, it just sounds like you’re getting a little tired. And so take a 30 minute nap, take an hour nap and come back and you’ll see how all of a sudden, instead of just pushing through a script, you’re really an active listener.


But that’s the only problem client meeting I had to have in the last six months where before God, David, it seemed like it was every day. People were just pinging me with this is a problem and that’s a problem. This is a problem. And I think that’s what led to my heart attack last year at 38 years old, was just having all these clients with all these complaints and it was just driving me crazy. And now I don’t have any of that. And so just sharing my experience, whether it’s true or false or somewhere in between. It’s just my anecdotal experience.

Speaker 3 (32:36):

Well, no, that’s really good. I wish we more time, but I’m going to land the plane here. We’ll have to do another episode too about how you got through that and coming out on the other side. But if people want to get ahold of you for your cold calling and what you’re doing there and how would they get ahold of you if they want to start to work with

Speaker 1 (32:54):

You? Yeah, whether it’s the cold calling or like I said, the loans where we’re offering a hundred percent financing on both the rehab and purchase price. If they’re my cold calling client, they can just email me at jen, JEN at rre I data source.net. I’m also a really brave person who gives out my cell phone because as a cold caller, I’m not afraid to call you. You

Speaker 3 (33:18):

Can call me,

Speaker 1 (33:19):

I may think you’re a spam call and answer a little bit briskly, but my cell phone is (469) 952-8011. Feel free to call me there or Jen at REI data source.net.

Speaker 3 (33:32):

Cool. So that’s how you could get ahold of Jen, and that’s the email. And she gave your phone number as well too, so you could call her in and say, Hey, hey, just wanted to see if you answer the phone. I’m sure you will. Like you said, who does that? Right? Who? Their cell phone. Cell phone. And then who does that? And then actually answers too. I feel like today’s age, please go to voicemail. So that was good stuff. Lots of valuable information here, stuff that you could take and I think implement right away to become these type of people out there that are consistently successful. And that’s one of their keys to success is being consistent in solving today’s problem, building the message around that as well too. I really liked your insight of the type of client you draw in when you are your authentic self versus where you might get more, but it might be more headaches if you are not. So it’s like just lots of good practical things today. So that was a lot of good stuff. Thank you for sharing, Jen. I really appreciate all that you did here today.

Speaker 1 (34:26):

I appreciate it. David, thank you so much for having, thanks for asking great questions.

Speaker 3 (34:30):

And I wanted to say too, if you’re listening to this and you’re like, oh my gosh, I’m not making enough or whatever, first of all, call Jen, you can literally call her. She gave you her number. She can help you make more money if you need to keep the money too. If you’re like, I have no idea where my money’s going, don’t know what my overhead is, don’t know how much I’m making, how much I’m keeping, or I want to keep more, you can reach out to us@simplecfo.com. We want to help you get at least that stuff in place because if you don’t have any idea, you’re not running a business. So that’s where I want to help you at least be consistent in knowing where your money’s going too. That’s another consistency factor as well too there. But Jen, again, thank you so much for coming on and sharing, and if there’s anything that you need from Jen, you know how to get ahold of her. She gave you the email address and her phone number. Again, thank you so much for coming on today.

Speaker 2 (35:17):

This episode of The Profit First for REI podcast is over, but there are plenty more where that came from. Are you ready to learn how David and his team can help implement the Profit First system in your business? Schedule a discovery call@simplecfo.com right now. We’ll see you next time on The Profit First for REI podcast with David Richter.